This is an important one and one that I have had discussions about. But before expanding on this, what do you mean by this? Examples please.

@Fredblack
Tell them how it is ...i never saw my folks argue either.... had their differences but because of the cultural allegiances its more than 2 people in a marriage family comes first they had to cool it in private...

@Incognito
How to make a man happy? stop trying to be one.

Just classic.....even the YT women are clamouring for the old style masculine type man not the woss our own women want us to be....just know your place and we know ours and everything would be sweet end of story....

[quote=astmartins;

Just classic.....even the YT women are clamouring for the old style masculine type man not the woss our own women want us to be....just know your place and we know ours and everything would be sweet end of story....[/QUOTE]

Yes, but most young couples and even mature ones don't get this. Before I talk about this from a woman's perspective, would you break this down for us - your place and mine/man's and woman's - what leads to this sweet end?

Fem'

reptative, tedious stuff,

if wanting to have a choice to go and work , or study, or have fun, or be single , or not wanting to have kids, or to play wii, xbox, or to laugh loud makes you a man..........than not only are we *like* men, but hulk hogans. 10001 *tips* that i bet you will end with same drab conclusion........cook.......the famine has returned. Domestic goddess be if you want to, not aspiration for those who chose not to be.

To be blunt.......no amount of examples, tips, whinge is going to change things, this is the way it is, and it will stay that way, either accept it, get over it, not accpet it, or turn gay.

we are the new generation, the young generation, we shall pave way from the point onwards ( gosh i have missed that quote lol)

get over it

For all your noise Soofresh you dont sound too happy about it.

We'll see in 15-20 years eh?

cmon now @fem you know the drill...bet you know a man and a woman's position in the home we take our cue from how we were brought up at least those from dual-parent families
Still confused ?.... buy a copy of man are from mars and women are from venus
women have to recognise that no matter how much you earn the man is the head of the family as long as he respects that honour and carries out those duties....you suppress that position everything falls apart no one is saying women should be a slave we all know its the women that run the home but when it comes to instilling discipline protecting and securing the family let the man do his thang...if women are not ready for this they not ready for marriage or a proper relationship...hence the huge number of black singleton women over here and the US in proportion to our population before someone jumps in and says singletons are not exclusive to only black women
I can't speak for the sistas but enough black professional brothas are not checking for that over ambitious career-oriented woman wants to have babies at 35years old smoke drink ...brothas just need a nice well bred sista good family values thats all

LOL - resident feminist eh???

@Soofresh
You not been to church lately have you ?plenty of women like you who said the exact things 10 years ago...remember those vibrators are cancerous now..you cannot love your career but you would soon learn

The issue for me is about social contract and social justice in terms of the content. In many ways the content may not be as important as the fundamentals in terms of what two people are trying to achieve, the best way for them to do so and its impact on their children and other members of the group and their families are obviously a part of that.

Also it is also about how those contracts are regualated and that is why for me we have a lot to learn, especially African-Caribbeans about the role of extended family and family conferences as used by West Africans.I think we would gain much dividends by learning some vital lessons there and how it can reinforce good conduct and practice for or against husband or wife.

It is no mistake the more Westernised Africans become in key areas the more problems they have in their family organisation, family life and the basic strength and capacity of that unit in being able to achieve any number of things..African-Caribbeans are not at the foot of the premiership league for want of a better term for nothing. No coincidence as many academics have noted they also have more western attitudes, especially our women even more than the white idigenous woman. You don't hear white women say they don't need men or children don't really need father to the degree which African-Caribbean women do and are record for saying so. It is also no surprise then that the attiude which some women illustrate at even publicly suggesting it is not a bad thing for a woman to want to please her man as a matter of laughter or snide comment?

And i bet you if we carried out research here and now you would probably find those attitudes more prevalent amongst women who are more westernised by whatever criteria we choose than those who are not. But lets not mess around this is clearly not working for us and one of our many family problems..Not going to say this by itself is the golden bullet, but an important one i would have thought.


The problem is this we as a culture and people are going through some serious cultural changes with various ideas, and values being bombarded on us not even a person as wise as the biblical Solomon can work out what are the real and numberous implications of these things before we buy into them with our heart and soul. Even the white woman doesn't buy into these things in that way because if you chose any ordinary profession or job such as police men. Most of their parnters and them relate on very traditional type of grounds..My director and Professor and his wife are very traditional and they aint old old people and most of my colleagues would generally fall into more or less the same pattern.

Life is far more easier and effective if people in any team are clear on some basic areas of fundamentals and only a minor or small areas still to be negotiated. Easier for them, their children and those they come into contact with. Let me give an example where my cousin's Ghanian woman is involved. She has already said that she sees her role and financial responsibilities is for caring and clothing her children and welfare eg medical stuff..My cousins responsibilities is for providing for the home and their future, school fees etc and long term investments. Once the children are of age she intends to start her own business which will allow her to combine both roles as mother and earner but close to home.

This is what she wants and what man who has a brain is going to disagree with her and how she was raised. Her Ewe mother is a business woman in her own right as is her Jamaican father. So her role is kind of like a defender in football to back up her husband who is the striker who has to go out there and do his thing however he does it. If he has to stay here great, if he has to go back home great..and that is no different than my grandparent. Grandfather went to Cuba and was already an established business man, granny stay home holding down camp and running family business. Grandad send money and plenty goodies home..Not alien to us culturally at all.

I think because we have become so westernized we think the man role so to speak means working for a company or getting a good job..When it can mean putting your life in danger going to strange foreign countries, living rough, doing shit work etc which is why the majority of first wave immigrants tend to be males. If you offered that part of the job description to many women they would run from it so, how we understand these things depends on our culture and values..My sisters would not want male roles, because it means dirty and rough things like sleeping on the floor. It is no accident that the most dangerous and often most important jobs in any civilsation even today is carried out overwhealming by men..Try mining, or working on oil rigs or those crazy jobs involving changing cables hundreds up mile up in the air..Try being a fisherman in any part of the world never mind those dangerous waters.

The type of jobs people like Sooofresh talk about are so small in actual percentage in the jobs done in human society they are not even worth talking about in numerical terms..When you got aggressive anti social neighbours taking the piss or with your children see who is the firs to volunteer who to go and deal with them. So whatever we agree our roles are we better be clear we understand them not only in terms of the benefits, but other obligations and costs going with them. Because i have never been with a black woman and don't care how she come with the new chat who is going to let me watch television or whatever and some neighbor or somebody outside is kicking up shit. Never and it will never happen either and any woman who had to go and deal with that more than once we would not have to bet money on what she would think of the man who is watching TV and not outside dealing with the issue.

In most culture, especially African based ones men are the protectors of women an d children and why as in my family men can sit around and food is brought to them or they suddenly lose power to use their hands or cook which they all can do..But then those women know if somebody has to go to prison for messing with them it will not be them will it. Just a cultural and social contract. Same way i spend more money on my wife than i would spend on myself on principle..Just contract.

[quote=fredblack 2;1455823But then those women know if somebody has to go to prison for messing with them it will not be them will it. Just a cultural and social contract. Same way i spend more money on my wife than i would spend on myself on principle..Just contract.[/QUOTE]

Reminds of when I said to the men in my house when someone was at the door and i didn't want to answer it, i said " the thing about being the woman in this house is that I can choose to open the door, you can't"! I guess this is a throw back to the day's when i was on my own and feared open the door if there was a white person standing there (throw back to the police raid i experienced). They understand this, and I appreciate the protective role that they play, especially when I want to lavish up in it on a duvet day LOL.

Femergy - no examples, just two words, masculinity and femininity.

Saying that, there are some men who are cowards and can't fight another man but don't ramp to fill a woman's face with fists. These men might not mind a lack of feminine quality in a bird...it helps them prove themself - send those knuckles home with some wicked intention if the woman believes she can go toe to toe with a punk

We are very easy to please:

Sex, sandwich, silence and sleep. If we get that, on a regular basis we'll just open up our wallet and tell women to reach in and take what you want.

up................