@Incog

I grew up with many who pretended to have African pride simply because their parents come from there and their surnames sold them out..these Africans have less pride in the homeland than a Chinaman.

There are 2 sides to this i can go as far as saying there are those with very African names and are as far from Africa as China.Names are important for an African but doesn't quantify their attachment for what Africa entails damn!!..we even have Africans not teaching their kids their native tongue
For the Diasporans reclaiming their name is a very personal emotive experience they have come to the point where they say I want to reconcile and you can see that through reading @pheno09's post
You have raised a Thread on this but it got ignored we need to have one of them Reconciliation conferences with Caribbeans and Africans...YT people suddenly now have a short memory and blame us for Slavery so its up to us to sort out this mess

A Quote

Africa where African-Americans must never be encouraged to see as home but rather as a dungeon from which the generous white man brought them out.

Incog & Pheno, i think that we may be misunderstanding each other. As stated in my earlier post, i understand the sentiment and agree with where that motivation for name change is coming from, no question.

The point i was trying to make is that we in the west are DIFFERENT to those residing in Africa, on just about every level and i am not just talking about economically. We are brothers and sisters, we just live in a different house. Our house has always got something good to eat and drink, a flat screen tv, garden and three bedrooms. They live in manner i think will only be construed as disrespectful if i describe it, so i wont.
So what if we have the same name or not? Can i share in their hard times? No. Will you? No. So instead of doing what is tangible, & makes a difference, we run around making token gestures instead of what is real. Our struggle is the same, its just that right now they are on the frontline, whereas time was the W.I & AA regiments were. Education about our history, is what we should be feeding our kids, not a name that is based off a lot of hurt and desperate attempt to heal. I know that burn, feel it every day.

Your name is what people call you, how you feel about yourself, your actions and your knowledge is what defines you.

BTW, The only reason my kids (With Jah's blessings) will have an African name is that my fiance is Nigerian and her grandad feels he MUST name every child born into the family!!!!

Baserbillion......I dont really understand how the economic hardship of the Africans you saw becomes an obstruction to changing a name. It doesn't change history......or is the issue that you were a little ashamed ?

I'm not trying to accuse you, but I dont quite see the connection. The difference between your access to material things and those poorer Africans you saw is no different to a Ghanaian or Nigerian who lives in the west and those back home who just dont have the same economic standing.

If you had gone to a rich community where people had more than you, would your stand be different?

I understand that the experience of often quite startling, but it still doesn't change your history.......your roots are still in Africa.

I think its more about how you see the situation. The fact that pencils were currency, to me, is something which would make me proud. In some communities that are deep in poverty, its crack or alchohol which becomes their currency. The people you saw see education, self development as their way out of the situation. Its just like kids who walk miles to go to school or do their homework by candlelight.........I would be proud of those people.

Anyhoo.....at least you are being honest about it.

BaserB - I do hear you. I often ask myself do we form unions based on global oppression or is real pride holding onto each individual culture. But I still say you're effectively describing tribalism and our biggest crime is retaining a village mentality based on so called differences.

I can relate to this perceived sense of pride in concept, even more so if independently each clan/tribe can hold their own but where I do have issues, and what is oh so ironic is that for all our differences, make a man who doesn't even share our homeland much less our skin colour come along offering trinkets and none of the differences seem to matter with them but costs lives between us.

I'm as indepndent as anyone but choose to share and unite in my belief that others are sharing and uniting with the same goals in mind yet I still got caught up in drama with a hustling babymother and a wotliss African using the opprtunity to disguise why he's a mini cab driver and why he lives where he does - he's now using Ligali in the same way.

With no pride our men who should be leading the pack have become wotliss brothas living on hand outs and we have babymammas playing their anti-black woman card everytime their lack of culture is exposed. We have very limited individual pride and absolutely no collective pride, it's the feeling of being ashamed that keeps us trapped as individuals in our villages.

The displaced African can make his mark by forgiving those on the continent for selling them out, this is not a cosmetic gesture, it's reconcilliation, advancement, ice breaking etc. Indeed I'd marry an African on the continent just to inherit the surname...but don't alienate me because i chose not to eat bushmeat...indeed I'd be looking to inpart some of my 'culture' as part of the union.

Thanks for showing maturity in disagreeing with me, i appreciate it as its often rare on forums.

Firstly, economics are not a barrier to changing your name, the point i am trying to make is that it just feels like a token gesture in forwarding our cause. High-lighting the economic disparity between us seemed like the most stark background on which to illustrate this.

Was i a little ashamed? Honestly? Yes & No. I guess you think thats a non-answer right? Well, i'll try to explain. Going to Africa WAS THE BEST THING THAT I HAVE EVER DONE. I felt a closeness with the Kenyans (and JAH, you'll know when you get there) that is difficult to describe, a brotherhood whilst recognising that we were different. Everyone greeted me and my fiance as 'brother or sister' almost without exception. They greeted white people with 'Mum & Dad, (I am cringing as i write this) which in its self shows a disturbed psychy, but thats another post! The art, the music, the food the conversation was beautiful and the countrys' views themselves BEYOND DESCRIPTION.

The downside was visiting an orphanage that is not much better than that we see on TV appeals. There were a few Whites with us, who you could just see were thinking, "why can't you do better?". So yes i was ashamed. Ashamed of the governments who actively aid and abiet Europe in its sustained ruthless, relentless savaging of Africa. Ashamed that for all the great men and women of our past nothing has changed, ashamed that Africa is decades if not centuries behind the rest of the world. Now guess what. UNTIL WE STOP TOKEN GESTURES IT WILL NOT CHANGE. Lets face facts, lets see it for what it is. Lets stop looking at Africa through Euphoric rose tinted glasses and REALLY TRY TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

Good lord, oh Mr Illuminati whitey must be laughing his ass off. Whilst we're changing our names in A FEW pockets he's funding his latest genocide in Darfur. Its brilliant.

Trading pens and pencils for food is not the way forward!!!!! Come on. I am not dissing them as thats all they as individuals can do, but for you to sit there behind your laptop, in your comfy house and see it as a good thing is mind boggling. No money is not everything, but that does not mean we don't need it. We do. Thats how the world works.

Lastly, its just amazing that the standard of education ther was nothing short of FANTASTIC. Those kids (3 - 7yrs old) would put they're western counterparts to shame.

Lastly, lastly, yes my roots are African, Yes i love who i am & where i'm from, yes i want to make it better. I don't mean to offend anyone and if i have i appologise, i just call it how i see it. I love your sentiment, understand where its from just disagree with its manifestation.

Chi - have a saying, be proud of africa instead of waiting for Africa to give you something to be proud of and you've given perfect illustrations of what pride is.

The real irony is much of our poverty is a consequence of disunity i.e. we do not have each others back so it's everyone for themselves yet we often hear arguments suggesting disunity is a consequence of being poor - poor in the head maybe.

Baser billion, I was in no way saying trading pencils for food is a good thing. I would never advocate that, I like everyone else would rather they didn't have to make that choice. I agree, we need money to live.....but money is not an expression of an individuals worth. The fact that an individual is poor shouldn't make you ashamed of them.

My point was really that often poverty leads people to be as self destructive as to engage in vices rather than tools to get out of the situation. You would have to ask yourself what a pencil represents.....well to me, it represents education, self development etc. They think like that because they may be down but they are not out. Its that type of spirit which makes a slave, know their situation yet still attempt to dig an underground railroad.


I agree with you about the state some of our countries are in, I myself came back from Nigeria not long ago, much of what I saw enraged me. There are many things I see in my country and community which I dont respect one bit, but I wont use it an an excuse to distance myself from my roots.

You have a point that some people engage in token gestures when renaming themselves, it often has its roots in what they see as rebellion to "the man" more than their own reconnection with Africa. Only the individual determines which it will be.

Incognito......yes, I agree we often dont have unity, and I feel its because we tend not to deal with issues which we know are there, whether its shame, anger, resentment, insecurity, inferiority. There is always an undertone of these emotions in one way or another. Many Black communities/countries worldwide have quite peculiar beginnings and many were hewn out of distrust, violence, forced union etc. How equipped are we really to perpetuate healthy communities, on which foundation? How far have we really gone to addressing our obstacles....(past just talking about it)?

I have a headache now.............lol

BaserB - admiral post. The question about African governments is a very serious one and almost stops you in your tracks - if they aint helping their own people who will inded who else can.

I am quite curious though how we never hear stories about African countries helping each other, is this because it never happens or just the fact the powers that be do not want people to believe it happens.

Helping the starving and destitute is one thing but where I will advance on your point about what can be done in real terms I will say this:

From giving our children African names, to embracing them with African references ingrained as part and parcel of their upbringing (as opposed to some abstract teaching for an hour every Saturday morning for a few months of their lives), it is up to us to promote Africa in any and as in many ways as we can. Only then will we see Africa as us as opposed to them and us. I will go as far as saying it doesn't even matter if they on the continent do not see us as them, the prosperity and the collective advancement of our unity in the diaspora will re-educate those who need it.

I've tried my bit on the charity front but it soon becaomes recognised that any real life changing continent advancing financial bail out needs to be done by those strangling the motherland out of existence.

Chi - this denial thing is extremely serious and what's made it worse is we are 'free' in the west to have and live by our own individual standards and opinions which means everybody is right. We have mastered the art of fronting where we fake looking good with lots to say but having nothing of substance to back it up - strip away the face pack and the rhetoric and all that's there is shame and embarrassment.

We live in a world of hype with brothas occupying jails and black women taking on the role of the white feminist (colour being a reference to no culture).

Still for all my opinions my words through the wrong eyes can be seen as racist but I'm a humanitarian at heart. Was at a Santana gig recently where he coined a phrase which sums it up for me, 'it's not about black and white, it's about the light'.

The promotion of Africa for me does not mean obsessing ourselves with tribal doctrine. From names to fashion to ceremonies to language, with enough people doing their little bit in respect for Africa, collectively this would go a long way but it starts with identity, and you and BaserB are very right, a cosmeticly given name is not an identity, I mean just look how many Africans have them.

If reclaiming your name is supposed to be the first step in reclaiming your identity then the fact that so many disassociate themselves from this very first step just shows you how much the utopia is never going to happen. We're already 500 years behind and still running backwards. The brainwash has us generating our own collective negative momentum, our collective wotlissness is nothing short of a self-fulfilling prophecy to the degree it's seen as a utopia in itself.

The name thing aside we have to change the legacy of the past not only here in the Diaspora believe me the same problems exist in parts of Africa again you cannot lump Africa as one. The fear and suspicion of another set of Black or African people is ever omni-present in Nigeria for instance my generation here and in Nigeria are changing this attitude we don't soak up to YT people-not receptive to so called hypocrite elders who live a complete lie and want to preach to you-intermarrying amongst the tribes...enterprising not neccesarily waiting for the govt-proud of the culture regardless..people in the Diaspora sometimes mention why are they proud anyways considering some of the poverty back where they originate from but go ask the Indian and Chinese the same question they have poverty too loads but they wouldn't have it any other way....and we see the results they are well on their way to being a superpower and economic might over here
The bushmeat was funny to me within the same context some Igbos or say Yorubas cannot really undertand hausa food and vice versa this thing cuts deeper not just here its somethign that came from Africa itself and this perceptions are what we need to change.we need to reconcile with the issues of the past affecting us head on there is an issue..lets keep doing this postive things bit by bit looking back in history the few tend to kick it off then the rest follow suit call it a sheep mentality

i can understand what your saying but what about the bloods and crips and any and every other gang thats out there in the world. so will the sheep mentality work for them? i know how we can get them on our side. if your interested in that then messege me. i need yall help to make a change.