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West India Regiment and its role in Africa
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Bredder Tukoma is Online
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Default West India Regiment and its role in Africa - 13-04-08, 11:57 AM

The First Black Britons : Review (Jamaica)

The First Black Britons is a wealth of information and historical discovery, delivered (to-camera) in a warm and ‘to-the-point’ style: the result of painstaking research, backed by dedicated and talented contributions from artists, technicians, educators and countless others (a huge debt of gratitude is owed to Historical Consultant, Prof. Roger Norman Buckley for his friendship, ready advice and support).
Ten years in the making, ‘The First Black Britons’ is a unique window on Jamaican heritage, and a powerful showcase for Jamaica’s leading actors and film-makers. Shot on location at historic landmarks Port Royal, Morant Bay Court House, and
Up Park Camp, the film boasts fine dramatic performances from Winston ‘Bello’ Bell, Carl Davis, Jerry Benswick, and, Miss Zandrian Maine. Their brilliant portrayals are captured by the sensitivity, skill and artistry of Director of Photography, Richard Lannaman, and his long-time collaborator, Sound Recording genius, Don MacGregor.

A 57-minute running time is divided into 3 x 18 minute stories:

Story 1 - 'Slaves In Red Coats':
How the government of abolitionist Prime Minister, William Pitt (the younger) secretly purchased a slave-army to defeat French and Napoleonic forces in the Americas.

Story 2 - 'The Queen's Gentlemen':
How Britain's first African army won the personal favour of Queen Victoria and carved a unique status for themselves as a new class of citizen - 'Black British'

Story 3 - 'The Prodigals Return':
How West India Regiment soldiers - 'the sons of slaves' - exacted bloody revenge on the 'Chiefdoms' that sold them into captivity, returning to West Africa to win 2 Victoria Cross medals, in a 'Boy's Own Adventure' of imperial conquest.


Anyone have more information on story 3. Did these negroes in the West India Regiment really see service in West Africa as " exacting bloody revenge".

Will black men be used in Africa fighting Africans in the future. What's changed in 100 years. The role of African Carribean regiments in European wars of conquest in Africa was not as benign as some would have you beleive.


Any more info appreciated.
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Default 13-04-08, 06:08 PM

Samuel Hodge(born Virgin Islands 1840c) recieved the Cross for the capture of Tubabecelong in Gambia 1866...He stormed the stockade with an axe.
It is claimed that Samuel Hodge of the 4th West Indian REgiment, was the first African to recieve the award

And William Gordon(born Jamaica 1864c) recieved his VC for his actions at Toniataba, Gambia 1892...He put himself in the line of fire to protect his 'superior'



Sergeant William J Gordon wearing his Victoria Cross in 1897...The cross is now held by the Military Museum, Kingston.

National Archives London.

The series WO 98 holds correspondence and papers concerning the Victoria Cross. This includes the original Royal Warrant signed by Queen Victoria (Catalogue reference WO 98/1). You can download the warrant free of charge.

WO 98 also holds Volumes 1 - 3 of the registers of awards which cover the period 1856 to 1944. The War Office produced these registers, consisting of London Gazette entries. The digitised registers are:

Victoria Cross Register, Volume 2, 16 August 1864 - 31 January 1900 (WO 98/4)


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.

Last edited by Tahliba; 14-04-08 at 10:22 AM.
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Default 14-04-08, 10:04 AM

Quote:
Did these negroes in the West India Regiment really see service in West Africa as " exacting bloody revenge".
I would be interested in the films makers evidence that this is so...But the West India Regiments service in West Africa was the Ashanti wars...Native Africans (mostly Fante) were part of these regiments.

Many of these regiment would have come across slave ships on their way to Central America...Maybe it was not so much seeking revenge but stopping the slave trade that inspired them.

Although William Gordons medal[1892-post 1888] was shamefully earned, putting down an African rebellion


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.
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Default 14-04-08, 10:27 AM



Samuel Hodge it is claimed was the grandson of Arthur Hodge, the British plantation owner hanged for the murder and cruel treatment of his slaves in the Virgin Islands.


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.
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Default 14-04-08, 05:54 PM

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Originally Posted by Bredder Tukoma View Post

Anyone have more information on story 3. Did these negroes in the West India Regiment really see service in West Africa as " exacting bloody revenge".

Will black men be used in Africa fighting Africans in the future. What's changed in 100 years. The role of African Carribean regiments in European wars of conquest in Africa was not as benign as some would have you beleive.


Any more info appreciated.


Hail up Tukoma!!!

Man, there's still soo much of our recent history still to uncover eh?

I've not known much about that colonial force to this point. I did know they were active in Sierra Leone.

On recent reading, it seems pretty clear that fighting for the european, raised for Africans, the similar contradictions as killing for them today does. Many of those Africans were "bought" by the British and then enlisted. Many Africans then probably fought for Europe, rather than be slaves on plantation. As today we have Africans who fight for what they see as a better life in the west or back in their homelands. (History repeats).

But, many Africans tried to escape, once they saw an opportunity. This was deemed mutiny by the british of course!



Many of our African ancestors left West Africa, centuries ago, in a time of great, civil War. (These battles continued in the Caribbean, just as the Spanish and british carried conflict from Europe to the Americas). This fighting allowed Europeans to procure Africans for plantations in the Americas thru them siding with one group over the other. Flooding Africa with guns and creating even greater division and distress in the process. The losers, often seeing Africa for the last time for the hell of America.

I can well believe then that some Africans would, if given the chance return to Africa and seek to continue conflict with particular ethnic groups. I know Akan groups in Jamaica, after slavery still wanted to wield power over other ethnic groups, so such sense and pride in a particular African worldview (tribalism), was in sharp contradiction to the later Pan Africanism that acted inclusively, and saw its birth in the Americas.



The greater contradiction was with the European (we have always culturally blamed Europe for the mass kidnapping and enslavement), as we later saw demonstrated by europe's full scale economic invasion into Africa (Berlin Conference).

Africans always knew who the gretaer enemy was, so to say that masses of African soldiers in those regiments were returning to seek revenge as their primary motive - I can't see that. African – Americans (in the Americas) use Anansy or Brer Rabbit as a source of ancient African wisdom. Many were not going fighting without great rewards for themselves.

Markedly, Africans, after Slavery had made home in the Caribbean and did not seem to want to return to Africa in a hurry; especially when they had fought for freedom on the bloody lands they now lived on and Africa was been manipulated by a sadistic, murderous Europe on the rise, and the short term results were uncertain. The Caribbean had become Africa. Still is.

Peace


History is a people's memory, and without a memory, man is demoted to the lower animals

Omowale Malcolm X (1925 - 1965)
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Default 14-04-08, 07:19 PM

Tahliba

Many thanks. Goes back to the adage "if you dont ask..". Just came across the info while browsing and was shocked to find out they had done service in West Africa. The ultimate contradiction. If you got any sources of the Ashanti wars re: West Indies Regiment and their deployment it would be good. But that info is a nice lead. Thanks again.

Breadfruit

Yes bro- plenty to discover...you wrote:

I can well believe then that some Africans would, if given the chance return to Africa and seek to continue conflict with particular ethnic groups. I know Akan groups in Jamaica, after slavery still wanted to wield power over other ethnic groups, so such sense and pride in a particular African worldview (tribalism), was in sharp contradiction to the later Pan Africanism that acted inclusively, and saw its birth in the Americas

Its my belief that Maroon cultures across the Americas were the first Pan Africanists (even if often if a large group would organsise their villages along ethnic lines which is natural). Been reading a book on Maroon cultures and what is interesting is that many maroons across the Americas agreed treaties with Europeans to return and fight for the respectivitive countries in war/ but many did not also. Most noticiably Palmeres in Brazil. But we were no strangers to fighting for Europeans as free men or enslaved if truth be told. As autonomous free communities or "Captain Sambo's". People under pressure and facing extreme brutality beyond what we can only imgaine you can understand and maybe even give them a bly. But to go to Africa and fight for the British. I really need to find some transcripts from these soldiers and see what the hell was really going on in their head. After all Jamaica have Vicky Cross in museums as a source of pride. People need to know if its really coconuts they are honouring.."exacting bloody revenge" is dangerous language.
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Default 15-04-08, 02:30 PM

@ Bredder Tukoma

The National Archives based in London Hold ton's of info on the Ashanti Wars.

The use of colonials and slaves for military purposes was very much the forte of the British, although some of the regiments were created by the French and given the name WIR under the British. Indian regiments were also used in West Africa (as well as to put down revolts amongst their own people) Whilst the WIR were used across the Caribbean not only to fight other imperial powers but also slave revolts...They also saw service in Palastine and India. Within Africa these regiments often fought alongside native African regiments.

One of the WIR even saw action in America(I assume against the French but not certain)

What I should point out that although the name West India Regiment is used continueousy from it's creation in the late 18thC they were often disbanded and reformed over the next two centuries.


And yes they were slaves often purchased by the military or press ganged afer being liberated from slave ships (post 1807-I imagine it is these particular soliders the author referrs to, since the Asanti would have been responsible for their predicament.)

There were also several cases (well documented) of mutiny's


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.
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Default 15-04-08, 02:57 PM

Quote:
But to go to Africa and fight for the British. I really need to find some transcripts from these soldiers and see what the hell was really going on in their head.
With the exception of the last two Ashanti Wars (late 19th early 20thC) I find it very unlikely that such tanscripts exist. I suspect the author is relying on European officers et al's interpretation of what 'was going on in their head'

I have sent an email to the production company asking them for sources of their evidence...awaiting reply.

Concerned that this is going out via bbc childrens education, which means most schools.

contact@sweetpotatoee.co.uk


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Default 15-04-08, 03:16 PM

WIR History: A really good site gives list of various regiments and active service with wealth of other info (alas nothing about personal experiences)
Check out the Slave Purchase link. Slave Purchase

The National Archives of the United Kingdom Home page of National Archives just type WIR [in full] in their catalogue search. This will only give you the reference code of documents. Although you can search the on-line docs but you have to pay to view them.

An example from Archives:

WO Records created or inherited by the War Office, Armed Forces, Judge Advocate General, and related bodies
Division within WO Records of the Royal Chelsea and Kilmainham Hospitals
WO 97 Royal Hospital Chelsea: Soldiers Service Documents
Subseries within WO 97 1760-1854: discharge papers arranged by regiment, but each described at item level. (WO 97/1-1271)
WO 97/1228 Royal Artillery: Foa - Fyf


Record Summary
Scope and content MARTIN FRENCH
Born Africa
Served in West India Regiment; Royal Artillery
Discharged aged 23
Covering dates 1845-1849

Held by The National Archives, Kew


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.

Last edited by Tahliba; 15-04-08 at 03:20 PM.
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