Glorification of european beauty standards. - Page 2

The Last African · (#26 (**permalink**))

Might I be so frank and ask exact in concrete terms what European beauty standards are...Thoth you were thread starter sso I assume you will answer.

Shemsi en Tehuti · (#27 (**permalink**))

Abissinia wrote:

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You are just as likely to hear African men refer to a dark skinned person in a negative tone and glorifying European beauty as African women.

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This is true...and some men have even gone on to process their hair as grown men and such thinking they are better than with their natural hair. However, I think that Black men have turned away from these things more than women. I mean, look at all the Black celebrities that people find attractive. I can't even think of one that is trying to look White besides Michael Jackson (but that is a different story altogether). However, when we look at the Black women that are celebrities, we can't tell what they really look like because they are absorbed with the Western standard of beauty. Then we wonder why people like Morris Chestnut and othershave found it easy for themto be with a White woman.

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Abissinia wrote: Mez actually brought up a very good point about why African women don’t buy in to this rubbish. We are both subjected to European standard of beauty, European men are aggressively promoted as the Epitome of manhood/brilliance just as their women are revered as the epitome of beauty and femininity, the difference is African women against all the promotion and the negative image of the African man we still remain loyal to ours.

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2 reasons:

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-Women of all ethnic groups and persuasions are always the most faithful to their own.

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-Black men, in general, have not adopted a White standardas theattractive man, therefore have not falsely conceded aesthetic inferiority as too many of our beautiful Black women already have.

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Abissinia wrote: What’s more bizarre and twisted about this whole thing is that the only lie African woman ever failed for is the European Female beauty (now that would make for a good discussion). If you like you could also argue that African women trying to look like a horse with one foot in the grave came about when African men succumbed to the lie and started comparing us to European women.

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Perhaps, butIMO Black men only made that comparison after Black women themselves endorsed it. Trust me, nearly everything young men do revolves around how we think women will respond. If even a quarter of allwomenwent natural, I guarantee you would see a revolutionary change in the Black man's perspective.

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Abissinia wrote: My point is we can find many many ways to blame each other at the end of the day we are all capable human beings with brain and the ability to think and decide for self.

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No argument there Abz...but I have to ask...do you not think that this percieved aesthetic inferiority to Whites, whether you feel it was started by men or women,is the root cause of the psychological damage that makes women perm hair, use weave, bleach skin, as well as men processing their hair and/orpursuing lighter-skinned or White women?

Blacknet has often talked about the psychological damage to women, so I thought it was pertinent to discuss how it factors in with men as wellbecause we need to truly love ourselves before we start asking for love from others.

--Thoth B3

Shemsi en Tehuti · (#28 (**permalink**))

LadyDay wrote:

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this is not representative of the entire race

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You are right...it is not. I just feel it is all too prevalent though; therefore, worth discussing.

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--Thoth B3

Shemsi en Tehuti · (#29 (**permalink**))

Dark Prince86 wrote:

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Might I be so frank and ask exact in concrete terms what European beauty standards are

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I thought I layed it out in thethe first post, as well as the picture attachment showing Erykah Badu & Tyra Banks. It is the idea that thoseaesthetics of Whites (straighthair, light or white skin,and thebrighter tones of makeup)are the standards of beauty. It is damaging when adopted by people of color.

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--Thoth B3

Mezmerized · (#30 (**permalink**))

Thoth B3 wrote:

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Mezmerized wrote:

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One question though, have you ever pulled your mother on that issue later on? I ask because it would interesting to see what your mother said and how she would have reacted to you asking such a question.

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I have not. I can talk to my mother about almost anything, but I have always been afraid to confront her on it.My mother raisedme all by herself, and so she isa very strong woman. I don't know if our relationship would be the same there after.

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There is no nicer way i can put this but i trully think your mother is the best person for you talk to about this topic. From what i have read in your response to Abs' post, i think this issue still affects you personaly and the way you view black women in general. Actually your response to Abs has taken back any kind of balance you showed in your earlier responses and, and i will respond to it later....

You say that your mother raised you all by herself, which means that she was your main parent who groomed you and influenced most of your outlook on life.thiswould explain why you see all this idolation of European beauty as the blackwomen's doing, because your first experience of it was from your mother....your fathermight not have beenaround to give you the male perspective on his idea of beauty, so you are probably only focusing on who was most closest to you, which is your mother.

Personaly, i think this thread could go on for 10 pages and i do not think that any of our opinions would make the slightest difference in helping you understand this issue, your only route would be to talk to your mother about it...if you are as close as you claim, and i know what Mamas are like with their boys, i trully believe you would be surprised that she might be willing to give you some perspective on why she behaved that way.

Your fear of things not being the same is a little over board i think.....unless this is one of those issues that are taboo in your household?confused3And given that i have seen you, you are far from what i would call a lighter African, so i would think that your mother could be of brown complexion....so her reaction to your choice of girl is probably what has brought this question to your mind, and perhaps you are worried that you might ruffle some feathers with your mother's feelings about the way she feels about herself.....i am sorry if i am going out of line here, but your response to Abs was of outershock to me so thats the only conclusion i could come up with.

Shemsi en Tehuti · (#31 (**permalink**))

Mezmerized wrote:

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There is no nicer way i can put this but i trully think your mother is the best person for you talk to about this topic. From what i have read in your response to Abs' post, i think this issue still affects you personaly and the way you view black women in general.

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I don't think it is that important. It is not effecting mylife or how I view women.I wasjust using a randomisolated example from my ownexperiences. It is just kind of awkward asking your mother why she thinks someone is ugly.

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I can think of countless examples throughout school and even in TV and movies where Black women have made snide remarks about other women regarding hair and skin color. It is nothing resounding from my childhood or anything...perhaps I am just too critical of things. From reading my other posts, you canprobably tell that I have the tendency to analyze things in depth,perhaps too much...

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--Thoth B3

Kibibi · (#32 (**permalink**))

I wouldargue that the majority of women who idolise the European standard of beauty and reject anything else is because they truly believe it is what men want-whether that is Black men or any other man or a combination of both.

The Black/African women who push the European ideal as the way to go, aren't they a symptom of a larger problem, rather than the cause of it?confused3

*I am no way suggesting that some women are NOT @ fault either for buying into it and continuing it...but ermm it's not as if the majority of Black men (from what I have seen) are rejecting this European standard-in fact they embrace and run with it.

No supply without demand and all of that...

Shemsi en Tehuti · (#33 (**permalink**))

BlackBeauty wrote:

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The Black/African women who push the European ideal as the way to go, aren't they a symptom of a larger problem, rather than the cause of it?confused3

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Woah...let's not make take that step. I am not saying that Black women are the "cause." Ifeel that women play a significant part in a man's psychology to pursue White women. Black women do not cause Black men to do anything...they have their own mind.However, theI think the logical conclusion thatsubconsciously registers whenBlack men see Black womentrying to look White is that White is better than Black. The man may not necessarily agree, and so makes up his own mind anyhow, but I don't think we can ignore that itis a factor in what men choose.

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BlackBeauty wrote: *I am no way suggesting that some women are NOT @ fault either for buying into it and continuing it...but ermm it's not as if the majority of Black men (from what I have seen) are rejecting this European standard-in fact they embrace and run with it.

No supply without demand and all of that...

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I definitely agree with that. I think the problem is that now many Black men are convinced as well that the White look is inherently better.

--Thoth B3

Adeola · (#34 (**permalink**))

Thoth B3 wrote:

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Dark Prince86 wrote:

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Might I be so frank and ask exact in concrete terms what European beauty standards are

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I thought I layed it out in thethe first post, as well as the picture attachment showing Erykah Badu & Tyra Banks. It is the idea that thoseaesthetics of Whites (straighthair, light or white skin,and thebrighter tones of makeup)are the standards of beauty. It is damaging when adopted by people of color.

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--Thoth B3

Totally disagree!!!!!

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I am all for the whole thing about westernised beauty standards, but I think that you are generalising a bit too much and I don't think it's fair. From reading this description, I would assume that if you saw me walking down the street, you would think that I'm trying to adopt a Western look.

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I wear weave in my hair, not all the time, most of the time. However,I also have plaits, cornrows etc. Most of the time however, I have my hair in a ponytail (with a weavetail)and yes, it's permed. I choose to wear my hair like this most of the time, because it's the hairstyle that suits me best.I wear make-up; highlighter on my cheeks to accentuate my cheekbones, something that does not belong to either a white or black women and sometimes I like to wear pink on my lips, again cos it suits me best. Dark colours do not suit me, because I have a small face with small features - so dark colours look weird on me (as they swamp my face). I'm not trying to look like a white woman, but I'm experimenting with looks, because it's something that we are able to do.

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And as for the features, well........... I have thin lips and it is something that is often mentioned, in (I suppose) a negative way, I have a broad nose, but nobody ever comments on that. Do you catch my drift?

Abissinia · (#35 (**permalink**))

Thoth B3 wrote:

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