If you're a parent who no longer lives with the mother/father of your child, how do you portray the values of a strong family unit, when indeed you yourself are from a broken relationship-a constant reminder to your child?

Isn't it impossible to not sound hypocritical?

Le Moor - I've started a couple of threads asking the same question and my conclusion is simply this, the question is irrelevant until you define what a family is. To many babymothers/babyfathers a child simply needs to know who you are, the distance between isn't an issue...even more so if you're a babyfather bankrolling the babymother.

Been here long enough to know now people defend predicaments not principles, indeed their principles are defined by their pridicament, a family is basically whatever situation they find themselves in now. When I hear people talking about children just need a positive male role model it makes me want to puke....low lives who don't know what a dad is speak sh1t like this.

Me personally, based on what I define as a family, I can't do nish for my children other than moral advice and buy them things. Yeah a trip to the park or cinema every now and then but nothing of any nurturing depth....just a superficial acquaintance. Probably the biggest adjustment of my life was seeing my children change from being my life to being a chapter in my life...dunno, maybe it's time to become a mini cab driver

If there is one thing that epitomises wotliss nastiness, for me it has got to be seeing little children who should be secure under their family roof being bounced between households for parental aquaintance. I'd rather the children stay one place, guess that fits my family model, a part time relationship with my children is an insult, on a par with having to go to some paedophile judge for him to tell me what kind of relationship I'm entitled to have with them.

I wonder what my babymother tells my boys about what to look for in a woman, and if she is the reference how she is moulding them to see that as normal...scary sh!t. As a part time dad, the most you will ever be to your kids is a friend, and babymothers actually get a kick out of knowing this.

You are sooo bitter...let it go and occupy yourself with being a 'better' father to your kids.

You know what I have and do know men like you...your destined to end up some sad, lonely old man. And your children will grow up to despise you.

Get fcuking over it and get on with your responsiblities...

Your babymother I hope is teaching your sons how not to behave as a man...What are you teaching them?

"values" Interesting concept.

Values such as what? What are the values of a strong family unit? How do you measure a 'unit'?

Tahliba - sounds too familiar huh. Getting over it, as I said, it all depends on what you call a family which will also determine what you mean by getting over it.

Tell a woman about values and don't be surprised to hear the reply, 'I've got my own job'. As far as family structure and infrastructure goes we epitomise wotlissness, if I was thinking of my own survival and how I look then getting over it would be a no brainer.

You talk about responsibilities, now can you be more specific in what that is in a babymother/babyfather living apart scenario, and where class and standard and culture fits into that?


Get over it, as the song goes, there's always something there to remind me, babymothers galore defending nothing else but babymotherism!! I will not be associated with such nastiness.

Melissa, relationsips breaking up assumes they were relationships to begin with. Again I suppose we need to define what a relationship is as I guarantee most weren't worth the superficial bullsh!t they were defined on and even most now are cosmetic gestures to appease the public.

To raise a strong family means having individual strength of character, shoring up the cracks and laying a stronger foundation, which often means making the best of a bad situation and just getting on with living life.
Children are like empty vessels, just waiting to be filled up and it is what you fill them up with, which determines how they turn out. When my children were younger, I took them to every museum or art gallery showing. They went with me to the library and were encouraged to take books that reflected their identity. They were encouraged to enter every competition to build their self-esteem. I read to them, sung to them, taught them to be the best they could be, as well as how to cook clean and iron but it did not end there because the most important aspect of parenting was to teach values and respect.
It was first being able to have a relationship with them so that they can talk to me about their problems, teenage angst etc. It was about them being able to voice their opinion with my decisions as regards to them. It was about being a friend but being a parent first and foremost. It was about being able to negotiate and to listen to their needs, about laying the foundations whereby they can talk and get information about personal stuff both pleasant and not so pleasant. It was about recognising that each child was different and developing strategies that reflected that individuality. It was also about making them feel that they were being treated fairly and that there was no favourite or partiality on my part.
I agree with Melissa about family being more than the nuclear type but unfortunately, people don’t take those roles seriously, to most people being an aunt, uncle or grandparent is just a name which they fail to act upon.
When my nieces and nephews were growing up, I took them every weekend and during the summer holidays. They went to work with me where I could keep an eye on them while introducing them to new experiences while helping them to develop new skills and experiences. I was their aunt and as such it was a role that I savoured. All too often I see children who don’t have a relationship with their aunts and uncles because they never took an interest in them, yet these same ‘relatives’ expect them to turn up at family gatherings and play happy families, as if all there is to being an uncle/aunt, is to ask how that individual is doing or to have a conversatin with them.
Recently, my children's grandmother died. Out of respect they went to the funeral but my son told me that he felt no sadness or grief because he did not have a relationship with her, which emphasises the point that it is more about building nurturing relationships than about familial ties and their paternal grandmother did not do that, so the children did not feel any sense of loss.
But it is also important to know who your children’s friends are and to steer them clear of negative influences. It is about setting standards and having expectations from children and about knowing them individually and not being afraid to admit to them that as a parent, you too made mistakes.
Another important factor for parents who live apart is to allow the child access to the absent parent. Often it was about trying to instil in them a general respect for people and that included the absent parent. But it was also about letting them see things as they were. Not building any false expectations for them to fall from when they were old enough to process the information, so it was about giving them the accurate picture as they were able to understand, as they matured emotionally. But as part of their identity they had a right to know their other half. Another aspect of parenting is to teach your children to love each other. It seems to be a foregone conclusion that siblings would naturally love each other but that is not the case. So children have to be taught how to love and care for each other.

Tahliba - can only reiterate people will only be arguing what it is they are defending, my children despising me and loneliness, please do not judge me by your standards.

Ironic how you hope you know what the babymother is doing yet you can categorically ask what it is I am doing. I can't work with babymothers, the very concept sickens my stomach, anything else would mean I'd have to lie to my kids and that would be a worse fate than them hating me or loneliness could ever be. If they are going to hate me it's because I stood for what I believe, I can happily take that to the grave.

When I see my boys I tell them the situation they are in is pure nastiness and to never ever believe this is normal and even worse make some Coronation Street watching mofo tell them who they are.

Fear, my worse fear is worse case they'll simply grow up to find out whta was really being defended for themselves.

Sargaco - I was never into this firefighting thing. I look at everything you have said and wonder why do we believe doing the things we do for our children is something special?

These bad situations we are trying to make good are caused by people not being genuine i.e lies, spies, hustlers and hypocrites, a bad sitaution can never get better on foundations like these which is why we look at trivial achievements as success stories. My brain cannot accommodate that level of thinking, I'd rather commit suicide.

Le Moor - no one has the right to judge anyone, I'll have an opinion on the frame of mind behind what people are defending though. Never thought i'd see the day when defending/sharing your values are seen by others as passing judgement on them. Lay with dogs you'll catch their fleas. As Sizzla says, he reminds them of who they are supposed to be or take it from Caplton, dem done bow already and they can't say they're sorry. I'll never apologise for my values, it's like mini cab drivers who expect you to feel guilty for having an academic able brain.

Part time dad?, please don't insult me....in todays environment you're part time even when living under the same roof. Many times I have had to work abroad, many times I come in when they have gone to bed and leave before they wake up and this is supposed to improve now you live apart, get real, my children will grow up with their own conscioussness or as i told the babymother, if it's about defending predicaments i do not expect her to raise them with family oriented African consciousnees, I mean how can she if she herself doesn't have it - and so the myth of absent dads and innocent babymothers continues for another generation

Incognito:
To do nothing is to opt out. When you opt out you don't have a say in how things go. My children are my most precious commodities and I will do whatever it takes to make them whole in a system that treats them as lesser beings. To quote a song by Gil Scot Heron,' home is where the hatred is.' and if there are problems in the home caused by whatever reason, children are going to go outside for their sense of identities. As a responsible adult who has willingly taken on that mantle, I chose to let my home and ideology towards my blood be a nurturing one, cause if I don't educate and love mine, someone less fit and capable is going to fill them with rubbish.
At the end of the day, people make choices about how they want to act out a situation. It's either fight or flight. I choose to do the best I can, so long as I have breath in me. You do what you chose to do. I have no problem with that!