MGL..said '
' said 'How many of the europeans who are Chief Executives and Finance Directors of FTSE 100 companies gained their positions by working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" and how many of them are sending their children to work in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" to prepare them to run multi-billion pound businesses?

Interesting question..Quite a few actually if the Harvard Business Review Special Edition and other things I have read are true..


Please tell us which ones.

MGL..Don't want to be rude but if you actually knew your subject with any real mastery you would know what I am talking about and would know the literature...As I mentioned a few examples above..but apparently you don't.

Here is the issue I mentioned. In fact I actually confused the issues of the Harvard Business Review in question by merging several special editions into one. The Issue I actually mentioned was the August 2003 entitled Leadership in a Changing World. But there are three over special editions and I shouldn't have to tell you the internet search king that it would take all our ten seconds to search the Harvard Business Review resources to find the debates about the relevance of an MBA compared to other forms of hands on training and examples of that. So you are just a lazy man with a lazy man argument.


But you ask me to name you one company and this edition I am citing is not on the education and training of corporate leadership, you will find that in other editions, where MBAs are being slagged off by those who actually run those programmes as well as leading business leaders. But here is what Stephen Green, CEO of the HSBC banking group one of the world leaders has to say about the issue:

'Most of our recruits are recent university graduates. We tend not to go out of our way for to look for the MBAs or people in their thirties. In fact, I think it's a mistake for companies to have too much of their top talent join their organizations in mid career. Our recruitment process is sophisticated involving a complex process of tests, interviews and exercises. We don't look so much at what they or where people have studied but rather their drive, initiative, cultural sensitivity and readiness to see the world as their oyster. Whether they have studied classics, economics, history or languages is irrelevant'.

By the way HSBC is famous in the global executive world for what they call their international officers and why I invest my hard earned in them...

BL sorry blood did not see this but big thanks..Can't understand certain man want to argue about today is not Tuesday but we all know yesterday was Monday..Pure waste of energy and ego shit...Save ego for serious things..

'@ MGL; Was only using business as an example but there are plenty of business peoples who have made it from the bottom up although some fake their stories and inherited their worth along the way... Richard Brandson for example is said to have worked in a market stall or something and moved on to set up the brand 'virgin' but his dad was rich and his last name is too ironic for that story to be true. Sainsburys was a market stall, Woolworths was small time at one point, Bill gates was another.

As F.B said there are probably more small to big time business peoples than there are inheritors of large companies and even then those smart ones tend to let their children work to better bring them into the runnings of a large company...

Partly why I made the thread as statistics would (probably) show that most successful people didn't have a formal education as though their grasping or coming to understand what ever industry they're in on their own without being told what is and isn't acceptable led them to breakthroughs as it were, as though it helped them path their own way to where they are now as models of said industry.

In my dads era I'd say that the most successful people made it on their own merit rather than one given to them by the education system maybe its changing now'.

Thanks bro.

FB

My wife has just reminded me of about 100 more people who have gone from small to mega who most folks know, not including Reginald Lewis the first black billionaire who did not even study business but basically was there when deals were being made in his capacity as a lawyer and do I have to go on. Should have saved your money on an MBA and asked my wife to teach you...

You clearly do not know much about business...or common sense to throw down a challenge to me in them ways after being here so long....If I don't know something no shame in saying so but when I dig my heels in tends to indicate something..

Thank you for your contributions.

You claimed on the basis of what you have read in the Harvard Business Review that "quite a few" Chief Executives and Finance Directors of FTSE 100 companies gained their positions by working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" and are sending their children to work in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand".

I asked which ones.

You cite Stephen Green, who you say is "CEO" of the HSBC Group. (He is in fact the Executive Group Chairman) and give us a quote from him which states:

"'Most of our recruits are recent university graduates."

He makes no reference to recruiting as managers people working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand". I doubt that he has suggested that any of his own children do so either.

You mention Richard Branson. He is not a CEO or Finance Director of any company in the FTSE 100.

You throw Bill Gates into the argument. He won a place at Harvard University, having excelled in mathematics and science as a child and having become a computing child prodigy.

You mention Sainsburys having been a market stall. It is not a market stall now and neither its CEO or Finance Director got their roles running a multi-billion pound business by working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand".

You mention "Woolworths was small time at one point". It isn't now. It has annual turnover of £2.7bn. I doubt that its senior management got their roles by working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" (unless, of course, you have read something to the contrary in "several issues" of the "Harvard Business Review").

I am afraid that I do not see how what you have posted actually supports your claims at all.

MGL..Bro you are being stupid. If you want me to cite actual people who ran hot dog stalls or do you actually understand what is meant by a general point. And this is the future of African or Pan African radicalism in Britain. God help us...Bro if you were so smart you would not be in this argument..would you. The argument is about many companies and top business leaders not only starting from small or bottom up to know their business but preferring people from that kind of background.

I gave you several examples and one book on top of my head if you know anything about business education you would have heard of Peters and Waterman and the examples and references in their book.

The HSBC example is of a similar type in sofar as they want people with basic education but appropriate characteristics...Not MBAs..Return the point back to its point of origin and where we started this discussion. Given that a basic degree really qualifies you for very little other than read, write, research and think at a minimalist level but not the crucial component in a business education or apprenticeship.

When you were actually arguing that an MBA prepares you for whatever, when it is clear to me you neither know much about business theoretically or run one to come with them fool fool arguments..I have two girl cousins with MBAs one from Harvard and one from City Uni in London. They did not get their senior positions because of it, but because of the practical business experience they had working with and for me...Both of them grew up working in our family shops and businesses back home as kids.Hence why they have their jobs and most of their other MBA friends are out of work or gone abroad to look work.

Stop acting like a fool. The notion that there are not business people who start small and prefer people coming up that way as BL said if you read biographies and autobiographies many big business people want their kids to go through the same system...The fact that you do not know this shows me you have no business in serious discussion and then have the front to tell man give you an example...Then you concede oh those practices existed one time but not necessarily now. Well what did I say from my first post or second post on the matter. That there is changes in corporate culture but not that does not mean these practices do not still exist and continue which is self evident in the HSBC example. Unless you are so dumb to assume that corporations are sending their people to work on hot dog vans or recruit them from there..

Go buy a good book or find or buy a friend..and stop insulting people or wanting to draw them down to your comedy level of argument...Arguments led by ego not acknowledge tend to end up one place..

QUOTE=MarcusGarveyLives;1446397]It seems to me that a good quality MBA is more likely to give an reasonable understanding of the international business environment, the required quantitative, analytic and strategic managerial skills to run complex multi-billion pound companies, and an understanding of regulatory environments and trends in corporate responsibility and shareholder activism than making the tea.[/quote]



Here is what you said and the context of the disagreement..

Tis a pitty that top companies like HSBC and many others don't share your view. Simple as and that is my point...Like fools who think getting a degree or even a Phd in Criminology going to make you a professional criminologist who actually works and earn money...Same shit practical experience

Education versus Experinece. Like the man said depends what you trying to attain.

Listened to a good documentary on Mutabaruka about the rise of fast food chains such as Mickey D/ Wimpy etc and they all were small man with experince in one man bands.. who later were in a position to take advantage of a break which came their way. As a black man in the West you will need a white man to front certain things for you as you may not get those breaks so readily. But there is always ways around that. So in business I would say defenitely no you dont need a MBA. But will it help. Of course it will. But give two people the same knife and you will get two levels of craft.

Further to that for every 20 black man/women Ive known that were doing business studies at college how many of them have business. Very few. Within a mundane field such as engineeriing then formal/ informal education is vital if not essential. Because to engineer in any field you need that thereorectical background. But it always amazes me to see multi skilled technicians in the Caribbena who can strip down a engine and build it back and have had no formal training/ or are self trained. Way I see it everybody got their calling. Some can utilise different tools with different success. Some of the best enginers Ive known didnt do one rass day in college/uni. But see their designs and everything under the sun is covered. Cant buy experinece. My conclusion. Quality experinece is more valuble than education everytime. But then isnt quality experience an education in itself. LOL.

Pimp a cracker, probably a market for it. Here at work its blatant that the business would be a success if we had a euro or two behind the counter fronting it. Not to rant, because I feel to, but damn its not easy when the oppression is on a man to man face to face level rather than implemented as most would assume it is. Bstards walk in take one look around and leave resentful at having to buy from us. Not easy catering to the devil.

Talking music industry (uk) here for the moment, its obvious own it (creatively) and have done for a while now, theres always something new coming out, new genres and so on but it goes untapped. If we had a Black Music industry over here it'd change things up good but would our music be so popular if we were in control of it? Black Music studios, distributors and so on? Not to be defeatist but I get the feeling it wouldn't.

@ MGL;

There was an article in the Sunday Mail (Live magazine) on two property developers by the name of Candy & Candy. They're worth an estimated £9 Billion but started off buying and renovating apartments with a twist on lifestyle which is what seems to have won their success.

They would renovate their properties to a high standard and have not only become major property developers but lifestyle merchants as well. They recently bought a chunk of London and built the 'One London' apartments with each selling at around £2 million alongside other projects in the city.... they're 34 and 35 years old and say that the best way to avoid fears of a global recession is to only deal in projects over £12 million.

Serious.

Its not about where they (Sainsburies, Brandson etc) are now, its how they got there... Brandson owns the Virgin brand and all of its umbrella companies btw. With the way hes marketed himself he could run for Prime Minister. .lol.

There are no europeans who are Chief Executives and Finance Directors of FTSE 100 companies who gained their positions by working in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" and none of them are sending their children to work in a "small one man shop or hotdog stand" to prepare them to run multi-billion pound businesses are they?