Originally posted by Justavoice:

Jesus - when mentioned this name can provoke so many different reactions. Some black men, at the mention of his name, see a image of a blue eyed longed haired white man, but is it so ?

Muslims - they say indeed he was a prophet, but will venture no more than this into the character of the greatest individual of all time..

Jesus - who do you think he his ?, 2000 years on but who is this man, that many shy away from - who told us such things as When you see me, you see the Father - so who is he ?

Why is it that western culture are prepared only to accept Jesus the baby and Jesus the crucified, but not Jesus the radical, Jesus the militant, Jesus the man of few but powerful words. People I want to hear your thoughts.

**Long tings alert**

revised post..

Justavoice: In your last post you infered that the colour of Jesus is not an issue, you then argued that we (I assumed you meant Africans) should not concern ourselves of his colour.

In reply I would argue that his colour ISan issue and go even further by saying that the dominant Eurocentric depiction of him and the other characters in the Bible is also very important and in my view questionable.

Thehistoric Eurocentric view is that GOD is white, his only begotten son is also depicted as white blue eyed (usually) blond haired (on occasion). The bible teaches us as I remember, that God is the creator, the Supreme Being, the Almighty, in effect perfection. His son fashioned in his image is regarded as the only thing to near perfection that walked the earth. We are told that he died to wipe away the sins of mankind, and that the ONLY way to salvation is through him.

If Spirituality operated in isolation to Politics, Education, Culture, History, Psychology or Science. I might tend to slightly agree with your view Justavoice, but unfortunately this is not the case. The fact is the Eurocentric dominance of the Bible influences very strongly all these areas of the above activities and more.

The problem for me is that by depicting Jesus & God as white the system has covertly and overtly set up an unquestionablebenchmark for perfection,thus by definition anything not resembling that benchmark is automatically considered that much further away from being perfect. So if you are female, Athiest, Black, Gay, etc you considered less than perfect in the spiritual hierarchy..

To use Psychology as an example, some of the most respected theorist obviously influence by the Bible. also incorporated thisbenchmark in their works.

Freud in 1912 in his book Totem & Tatoo Refers to the practises and behaviours of Africans as ‘savage’ & ‘primative’.

Jung in 1950 in his book ‘On the Psychology of the Negro’ Blames the sexual repression of ‘White’ Americans on the presence of Blacks in the USA and the mixing of whites with the ‘lower races’ which he identifies as Negros.

Finally Edward Thorndike (considered a great in American Psychology) believed and stated ‘That the institution of slavery existed because the blackmans nature was conductive to exploitation’.

These people were Christians who believed in the Bible, I argue that because there is this now a pervasive acceptance of this benchmark that is given added weight bythe Bible. Nobody dares questions or would even thinks to challenge this racist and inappropriate subtext to how Jesus is protrayed especially when it is underpinned by religion and then backed up by the leading, respected and foremost European thinkers and leaders.

This is one of the reasons why Slavery (the exploitation of Humans)was allowed to go on for the period that it did because, its roots was underpinned inthe benchmark underpinned by the bible. TheBibles theory ‘the curse of HAM.’ speaks to this arguement. Today this same benchmark underpins criterions used in modern day Psychology and other areas of sceience and history being taught and practised in the western world. This in my viewaccounts in part for the disproportionate number of Africans in Institutions world wide. Because the Eurocentric system that judges and treats them, does so against the backdrop that of these norms and values this is obviously a contradiction.

To conclude this point C. Rogers in his views on self concept, identifies two basic needs.:

Self actualisation, which he saw as the need to strive to explore one’s talents, education or physical and Psychological skills.

The Second is ‘Positive regard’ which he saw as love, affection and respect from others. He felt that these two components were essential to a healthy and centred development.

My point is I don’t see how a Africans can achieve this ‘Proper’ essence of spirituality that you speak of when the religious system on offer is heavily dominated by European values,norms and standards.


If as you assert that colour does not matter, I would ask you to put that same point to the KKK or the ruling class in Azania during apartheid and see if a black Jesus would not contradict their values and self perception. I find It amazing how some people of colour are always asked to be colour blind when it comes to the bible but this, blindness does not extent to Europeans.

Finally you wrongly inferred that Jesus would look like the present day Jews. I’m sure you are aware that the Jews who occupy what was known as Palestine are settlers and are not indigenous to the region. Just as the present day Americans are not the original people of North America or the Present day people of the Caribbean. (the original people of course being native Indians.) If you are saying that Jesus would look like a Jew then you undermine your point because that would make him BLACK as the original Jews are from Ethiopia. This further highlights the weakness in quoting from the Bible without additional knowledge of History and demography.

**message edit**

In fact I'm not going to get involved in this board. Ignore my previous message if youalready readit.

Can i ask why Prince Hakeem?

Kunjufu wrote: [quote]I have my reasons which are better left unsaid. Just don't expect any contributions from me on here.

ok..point taken...

to me jesus was a man like any other man, but he had a great gift from god and he recognized it and used it to help people, i believe he had compassion which many of us have also, but we today choose not to use our gifts because our spirit has been tainted and disconnected from god

i believe jesus was a man of many emotions, i don't believe that he was this man who never got angry, never got sad, never had a woman in his life, never had relations...HE WAS A HUMAN..

i believe thatthere were many prophets before jesus, and after

why people chooseto believe thatjesus was the only one, confuses me.. confused3

truth is truth

Bismillaah Salaam, Prophet Isa [Jesus, may The Peace and Blessings of The Compassionate, The Merciful, be upon Him] is The Messiah [Christ] "Anointed" of THE GOD {Allaah, The Holy, The Honourer}. His teaching included the statement "The Kingdom of {THE} GOD, is within you." The details of the Way to find this "Kingdom" is in "The Revelation Of [ST] John" and "The Gospel According To John". Salaam. OriginalBM

Bismillaah Salaam, Kareem. Why do you believe that the message of Prophet Isa, may the blessings and Peace of The Merciful, The Compasionate be upon Him, was Only, to the lost sheep of Israel. You also state in anothermessage that these lost sheep are Ethiopian, Egyptian, Asian (?). Salaam. OriginalBM

Kareem wrote: [quote]but kareem ..i am on my own path niceone.gif clp)

Kareem wrote:[quote]blkhug blkrubhead

babes1 wrote: [quote]http://websyte.com/Unity/cady.htm