WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT ISLAM????????? - Page 2

Lexi · (#26 (**permalink**))

Seventh_Angel wrote:

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From Surah 90...
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8. Have We not given him two eyes,

This one verse is sufficient to put to rest false claim that ISLAM condones Slavery.

It can't be sufficient when its a historical fact that muslims DID help in slave the black people.

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Fact is Fact my brother.If you do not wish to embrace the truth how will you ever excel.Learn to except what happened to our ancestors because its part of our history-its part of where we came from. cha!

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Question-when you quoted the quoted the koran u mention 'WE'-who is the koran referring to?I thought muslims believe in allah alone.I know it couldn't have been the angels who helped allah create mankind (according to the koran).Who else was in heaven?

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If it was referring to allah and some one else then the implications are that allah is not all mighty then after all if he needs help from his angels who are less then humans.

imported_Seventh_Angel · (#27 (**permalink**))

Lexi wrote:

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It can't be sufficient when its a historical fact that muslims DID help in slave the black people.

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What Islam CONDONES, and what those who claim to follow it DO, are not always the same thing. What African Culture CONDONES, and what those who claim to live by it DO, are not always the same thing. What "Christianity" CONDONES, and what those who claim to follow it DO, are not always the same thing. The PATH is not to be blamed for the errors of those who claim to walk it.

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Fact is Fact my brother.If you do not wish to embrace the truth how will you ever excel.Learn to except what happened to our ancestors because its part of our history-its part of where we came from. cha!

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You're right, FACT is FACT; and the FACT is AFRICA was not carved up by Muslim colonial powers, but by "CHRISTIAN" colonial powers. To this day, Africa is not being choked to death by MUSLIM colonial powers, but by "CHRISTIAN" colonial powers. I deliberately put it in quotes, because I KNOW that Jesus never advocated such wickedness, no matter HOW MANY people use His name to try to "justify" it. And don't bring up SUDAN, because that is a CIVIL war, not a Colonial exercise, and NEITHER side in that war claims it to be a RELIGIOUS matter. That is a FACT. It is the Western Media, who hates ALL Black People, who try to spin it as a RELIGIOUS war, to put black muslims against black christians.

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Your premise I absolutely agree with. The motive for stating it, however, is misplaced.

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Question-when you quoted the quoted the koran u mention 'WE'-who is the koran referring to?I thought muslims believe in allah alone.I know it couldn't have been the angels who helped allah create mankind (according to the koran).Who else was in heaven?

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The "WE" in the Holy Qur'an is the same as the "US" in the Bible - the Elohim - where it says, "Let US make man..." But these things are to be UNDERSTOOD.

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If it was referring to allah and some one else then the implications are that allah is not all mighty then after all if he needs help from his angels who are less then humans.

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This, again, is an ASSUMPTION based on your lack of understanding of what is actually being said. You are assuming that my belief, knowledge and understanding is that of a "typical" Believer...heaven in the sky...hell underground...God is a Spook or Spirit. As A Student of the Hon. Louis Farrakhan and the Teachings of the Hon. Elijah Muhammad, I don't have those views.

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Check this link, if you dare: WHERE DID THE DEVIL COME FROM? It will give you a small taste of what I mean.

Lexi · (#28 (**permalink**))

Question-when you quoted the quoted the koran u mention 'WE'-who is the koran referring to?I thought muslims believe in allah alone.I know it couldn't have been the angels who helped allah create mankind (according to the koran).Who else was in heaven?

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The "WE" in the Holy Qur'an is the same as the "US" in the Bible - the Elohim - where it says, "Let US make man..." But these things are to be UNDERSTOOD.(BACKFOOT! and Dutty cheese!)Patwa-which 4 you needs to be understood!

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When the bible states us it means us.The Father son and Holy ghost.

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So what does the word 'we' apply to in the context used in the koran.Do you even understand it yourself? is that why you couldn't explain in to me?

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Jesus help you 7th angel

imported_Seventh_Angel · (#29 (**permalink**))

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Salaam...

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If you know anything about the historical context of the "US" in the Old Testament, you know that it was written in HEBREW; and the "God" who made man, in Hebrew is "Elohim", which is a plural form, hence "let US make man". Now, if that were referring to the "trinity" as you claim, then why is the "trinity" NEVER mentioned by name in the ENTIRE Old Testament? For that matter, neither is it used by Name in the New Testament.

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The Us of the Old Testament are HUMAN BEINGS of SUPREME POWER and WISDOM. Consider the following:

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"7 And the Philistines were afraid, for they said, God is come into the camp. And they said, Woe unto us! for there hath not been such a thing heretofore. 8 Woe unto us! who shall deliver us out of the hand of these mighty Gods? these are the Gods that smote the Egyptians with all the plagues in the wilderness." - 1 Samuel, Ch. 4

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Not "the Trinity", but "the GODS".

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What you are stating, about the "trinity", is what came from the Nicene Creed, and the Council of Nicea in the year 325 A.D. That's where the Doctrine of the "trinity" was formulated and canonized.

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So, Like I said, these things are to be UNDERSTOOD, because in the immortal words of Stevie Wonder

..."when you BELIEVE in things that you don't UNDERSTAND, then you suffer. SUPERSTITION aint the way."

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In another thread, you claimed that Muslims "don't believe in the Holy Spirit". Here's something from the Holy Qur'an, which you know is the sacred text that all Muslims live by...or SHOULD BE living by...lol. Anyway, here it is:

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"And We indeed gave Moses the Book and We sent messengers after him one after another; and We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear arguments and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit. Is it then that whenever there came to you a messenger with what your souls desired not, you were arrogant? And some you gave the lie to and others you would slay." --2:87

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"We have made some of these messengers to excel others. Among them are they to whom Allah spoke, and some of them He exalted by (many) degrees of rank. And We gave clear arguments to Jesus son of Mary, and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit. And if Allah had pleased, those after them would not have fought one with another after clear arguments had come to them, but they disagreed; so some of them believed and some of them denied. And if Allah had pleased they would not have fought one with another, but Allah does what He intends." --2:253

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"When Allah will say: O Jesus, son of Mary, remember My favour to thee and to thy mother, when I strengthened thee with the Holy Spirit; thou spokest to people in the cradle and in old age, and when I taught thee the Book and the Wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel, and when thou didst determine out of clay a thing like the form of a bird by My permission, then thou didst breathe into it and it became a bird by My permission; and thou didst heal the blind and the leprous by My permission; and when thou didst raise the dead by My permission; and when I withheld the Children of Israel from thee when thou camest to them with clear arguments - but those of them who disbelieved said: This is nothing but clear enchantment." --5:110

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"And when We change a message for a message -- and Allah knows best what He reveals -- they say: Thou art only a forger. Nay, most of them know not.
Say: The Holy Spirit has revealed it from thy Lord with truth, that it may establish those who believe, and as a guidance and good news for those who submit." --16:101,102

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So, you were WRONG about Muslims not believing in the Holy Spirit. What else are you wrong about? Something to think about.

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My advice to you, and others, would be to READ the Qur'an before you try to Evaluate or Criticize it.

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Like I said, these things are to be UNDERSTOOD. The question is, do you really wish to understand? It's a rhetorical question...doesn't require an answer.

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"ONE LEARNED BELIEVER is harder on the devil than a THOUSAND IGNORANT WORSHIPPERS." I don't want to be an "ignorant worshipper", do YOU?

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RM

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Justavoice · (#30 (**permalink**))

@Seventh_Angel,

You certainly do know your bible and its history.

"When Allah will say: O Jesus, son of Mary, remember My favour to thee and to thy mother, when I strengthened thee with the Holy Spirit; thou spokest to people in the cradle and in old age, and when I taught thee the Book and the Wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel, and when thou didst determine out of clay a thing like the form of a bird by My permission, then thou didst breathe into it and it became a bird by My permission; and thou didst heal the blind and the leprous by My permission; and when thou didst raise the dead by My permission; and when I withheld the Children of Israel from thee when thou camest to them with clear arguments - but those of them who disbelieved said: This is nothing but clear enchantment." --5:110

God taught Jesus the Gospel ? or did Jesus fulfill the Old Testament and in so doing the Gospel are the accounts of his life ?.

Your right about trinity though, can't argue with you there, the bible does not mention trinity. God is one God.

imported_Seventh_Angel · (#31 (**permalink**))

Salaam to all...

Good question, JustaVoice.

Jesus, in the Bible says, "Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things." --Jn. 8:28

Peace to you and yours.

chinkkie · (#32 (**permalink**))

you got some evidence to back that up??

..... or is that solely based onthe theory of copy and paste??

we need him back 2 · (#33 (**permalink**))

ISLAM never dies,

Its the people that die and make mistakes.

The punishment meted out to Muslims for their crimes in this World is there for all to see. Indeed, the extent and pace of our decline has been in true proportion to the extent and pace of our negligence and failure to do our duty to witness to the Truth and our 'progress' in witnessing to falsehood.

I dont wanna write to much, so am go to end it with this:

This future is yours! But only if you (Muslims) follow Islam sincerely ana exclusively and serve as its faithful witnesses. Our present conduct, however, is entirely contrary. We have been blessed with the Divine guidance, but, likea snake guarding treasure, we neither benefit from it ourselves nor allow others to benefit from it. By calling ourselves Muslims, we have assumed for ourselves the position of Islam representatives, but the combined witness of our words and deeds is being given mostly in favour of Ignorance(Jahiliyah), idolatry, materialism and immorality.

We have the Book of Allah with us, but we have put it on the shelf and to seek guidance, we turn to all sorts of persons who lead to Kufr, and to sources which lead us astray.

Something to remind Muslim peeps in here.

Peace out

chinkkie · (#34 (**permalink**))

.....however, remember there is good and bad people in all types of groups, not just with muslims or within islam or religion.

Do not ignore that some of those muslims that are punished and die for their crimes or actions are in fact innocent and good muslims, such as many of those in iraq, afghanistan, chechnya, and palistine

the point that i think should be more appropriatly made is that accept to the fact that many do wrong and if you are one of them then you have a duty to your deen to change this. muslims that do not follow the guidelines of islam are not acting as muslims and are not representing islam, and this should be made more clear in the media instead of calling terrorists or wrongdoers islamic fundamentalists or islamists. such names are mismatched as even if these people say they are muslims, they do not represent ISLAM and are not supported by ISLAM.

Islam is the worlds fastest growing religion even in the face of this adversity. Many have benefited from Islam, myself included. There are many good muslims worldwide who display good conduct and character in accordance with Qur'an and Sunnah. there is nothing wrong with seeking guidance from your muslim brother or sister, imam, literiture of scholars, as well as the Qur'an and Sunnah. Islam is a community which means it is a resource for the people and should be used as such.