This is really doing my head in, seems that most young people of African descent nowadays are doing IT or Business Studies, now I'm not saying that we do not need people in our communities with these skills but we also need architects, doctors, engineers, nurses, teachers

so someone please explain this 'phenomenon' to me and how it serves our community (beyond the aspirations of the individual)

Sista Africa wrote:
why not??

Everybody doesn't have the skillset to be a architect/doctor/nurse etc.. Should we who don't, or who simply don't enjoy those career paths and what they entail, follow them (and most likely fail along the way) just because?? confused2

We need more professionals full stop - don't try to knock people for whatever path they choose to get there. IT has developed rapidly, particularly over the past decade or so, so providing greater opportunites for careers and advancement there, so of course young people are going to jump in. Speaking for myself, I want to study and understand business so I can eventually escape from having to slave to earn a wage for somebody else. Being an architect/engineer/doctor etc. holds no interest for me. Simpleconfused3

Blick-Brotha

So are you saying that we of African descentcannot do anything but IT and Business Studies? |If you look in any university we are over-represented in these departments and under-represented in science, engineering, mathematics, medicineand other disciplines yet we need these skills to build our communities and countries

I don't have a problem with anyone studying these courses my concern is at the over-representation of people of African descent in on these courses as opposed to engineering for instance, if you look at it purely on an individual level then there's no problem but if you look wider than this, particularly globally then the issue is critical as a people we need a wide range of professional skills it is not and should not just be about 'what the individual wants' but also what is needed, even this very individualistic society recignises that which is why for instance ther is a push to encourage more science undergraduates (they're just not encouraging us)

Engineering and IT are related. With the exception of those who studied only computer science, a lot of people in IT can also be classified as Engineers. Take for example, Software Engineerswill tell you they are intoIT, but they are also Engineers.At the moment I refer to myself as an IT guy, but while I was in Uni I was an Engineering student.I am a qualified Engineer.The same goes for Hardware Engineers, Computer & Electronic Engineers etc.They may tell you they are into IT, but they are still engineers. So a lot of black people are in Engineering, not sure about other areas like medicine etc.

To answer your question, there is money there. Even though it is kind of slow at the moment. Also that is where the future is heading. Not saying we don't need Doctors or they don't pay a lot for other jobs, but IT is not that difficult.

A good topic. I'm coming at this as a parent (my eldest starts uni later this year), and from a sometime professional interest.

Reasons?To me, two stand out - grades and guidance. On the point of grades, I don't know how well black students do as a wholeat A-level; getting access tosome subjects (in particular medicine)means having good grades, and the real work for this starts at GCSE time. If someone can correct me please do so, but I would guess that the level of achievement at A-level is relevant to the situation we now see.As far as I know, black students are much more likely to be represented in the so-called 'new' universities (ex-polytechnics).This is partly because they seemto be better at attracting them - the flipsideis thatthere is often a deep bias against degrees gained from these universities, which will again count at employment time.

Even if you have the grades, though, they are only as good as the guidance you get in making choices about which course at which uni, andwhat support you get whilst you are actually studying.If you are a parent who did not attend university in this country, you will do the best you can - and there will be things that you simply do not know to pass on to your son or daughter. Can you rely on schools to support you? Depends on the school, but I know that many are very poor in this area.Compare this with a fair number of those at medical school (again for example), many of whom will have come from families for whom that path is well trodden, and who will have been getting formal and informal guidance for a number of years, and will continue to receive it whilst studying.

I suspect what we have at the moment are literally thousands of talented and able students getting by as best as they know how, with limited information - hence they go for what they determineare the options which will maximise their employment chances in the short term. The kind of choices that you see being made now are the surface evidence of that; I think it masks a deeper issue which isn't simple to diagnose, but has major implications for the future of our community, here and worldwide.

Within this post,you have talked about qualification, guardiance and the individualist society as part of the reasons in explaining the decision for many young black people, especially of African descent to divert away from such profession as Doctor, Engineer, Nurse, teacher...

I think the underline reason why many young people choose IT and business is because of 'money'. Most Africans think like entrepreneur, taking the opportunity of the industrial demand, in such profession as IT, because of the enormous income that can be obtain in such professions in such a short period. However at this moment the IT employment market as been saturated by increasing number of IT training agency establish to meet the late demands of the 1990s and early century. But if the number of people are not into IT, then the next emerging industry that as high demand and a nice healthy wage package, will see the influx of young candidates interested in being employed that particular sector. i.e. plumbing...

A common factor getting into an high demand industrial is the ease to enter the industry. When there is a high demand in particular sector the typical prejudice or racial barriers and lack of experience that are mainly obvious or required with other professions are made relax, making entry less difficult and more attractive to most young people who with other professions may lacked the experience or just simply find it difficult to progress up the career ladder because of their age, color… discrimination.

Business, majority of people have aspiration to work for themselves. I know the possibility of owning my own business is certainly a motivation behind my studies and enthusiasm to learn. But at the same time, the opportunity to create your own business is becoming easier, with business advises and resources available to anyone who is interested. So with those free advise to bring ideas into reality taking away day-to-day pressure of some racist white dude, whose qualification is his color compared to your master degree will certainly propel you to start-up your own business.

My conclusion is thequick and fast incomethat can be gained within the IT or high industrial demand sectors are the reason for most people getting into this professions. Other reasons are subjected to personal preference...

@ sista africa

Since your all concerned about there not being enough doctors, teachers, architects etc. what profession are u in and what part are u playing in helping the community?

@ I lay

Don't doubt what you say about money being the motivator; I wonder how many people are successful in achieving the goal of high earnings immediately upon graduation? What earnings level would be considered 'high' at this stage?

From what I know of graduate employment rates,I would guess that not everyone is successful. In IT, maybe so, though most employers I've ever dealt with value experience and outlook more than paper...for business studies grads, unless you're getting into a prestigious firm or professionwith a good degree from one of the elite institutions, you would be doing extremely well to be earning more than 20k a year. The people I'm concerned about are those who have that expectation but do not possess the means to realise it, believing that a degree will be the only passport they need. The skills you need to build and sustain a business that will yield high earnings are not those you learn on a business studies degree...and there are plenty of subjects that will get you there other than business studies.

There ismore to gaining adegree than maximising your capacity to earn very fast bucks. To me, that is very short-sighted thinking.

@Blick-Brotha

This is not a personal attack so don't take it as such, the point I am raising is that from where I am looking NOT ENOUGH of our young people are following the career paths I mentioned and TOO MANY are opting for courses liek business studies. I do not have a problem with anyone following these paths, I do howver feel that we are over representedon these courses in higher education establishments

Things may be different in the US I don't know

There was a news item on the TV here last night about the under-represenation of women in surgery and soem of the reasons for it, strategies are now being put in place to encourgae more female surgeons, women it seems are not encouraged to go into surgery, we it seems are not encourage or motivated to pursue careers in certain disciplines

The other reason I have raise this is that there are a whole heap of unemployed IT/business graduates out there (a rare phenomenon in the world of medicine in particular)

You've raise some interesting points but raise more whys in my mind, why do so many switch from science/engineering courses for instance?

@Facetygal

When I understand the relevance of your post I will repsond to it

@ Sista Africa - excellent post and excellent question. (I am glad that you are rising above the personal attack and keeping it real). I have asked myself this question for a couple of years now. More and more young people (and it is not just a black phenomema) are opting for computer science degrees rather than traditional "professional" degrees. It will definately affect us in the future.

@ Soul rebel - your insights on this were spot on. I think its exactly as you describe.

@ Saint - over here in the US, software engineers are NOT engineers....many dont even have degrees let alone an engineer degree. I am not saying that there are not those, like you, who have traditional engineering degrees and then go into IT but it is not a common path.

@Happiness, I still struggle till today to understand the American System. Infact when i mentioned computer science I was refering to USA and some other places. We had people doing computer science and mathematics, computer science and business studies, I agree those one are not engineers. But we also had those doing Computer Networking, computer System and software Engineering and those doing communication Engineer. whilst they are still engineers, they are into IT. All these department were under that Engineering sections, and we did all those basic Engineering stuffs like Engineering Applications etc. And our degree title is (Beng). I know you not saying allsoftware Engineers are not Engineers, but I reckon a lot of the older generation in IT may not havea degree or have IT degree as it wasn't available when they were studying or during there time. But these days, a lot of the young software Engineers have degrees and some sort of qualification.

Back to the main subject, there are a lot of black people in enigeering, go to any Uni and find out.