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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,849
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: , , United Kingdom
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imported post -
19-02-07, 07:29 PM
I have a mixed race niece, she has my brother's black features and her mother's white skin and hair type. You cannot put her in a category and say she is one over the other, she isthe product of 2 races not 1, therefore she is mixed race. End of
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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,110
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: USA
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imported post -
19-02-07, 07:35 PM
Dark Prince wrote:
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The Watcher wrote:
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"white people see us all as black anyway so effectively they're black"
It's not up to white people to define either mixed/biracial people nor black people. It's long past time we learned that.
Well YT"invented" this shyt in the first place didn't they ?
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YT sure did invent this shyt and since we feel it's not up to them to define us, why stop at biracials? Why not also assert that we recognize no racial category and stop calling ourselves Black or responding from that worldview? Black folks outside of predominantly white countries don't see themselves as Black in the same way that Blacks in those societies have been forced to, ie as a cultural as well as biological identity(get miffed if you SAY THEY SHOULD, identify with someone not of their class JUST because they are "Black"). If white folks hadn't defined Black folks with TWO Black parents as Black, in AMerica, at least, we'd all still be running around hollering about being Ibo, Hausa, Mandinka, etc, disunified and at cross purposes. Stop acting as if THAT identification has anything to do with our CHOICE/INCLINATION/DRUTHERS, it didn't and doesn't. You can see the truth of that in how hard it is to get FULL BLOODED "Black" folks from all around the world to see themselves as connected beyond all their various ethnic/tribal/cultural distinctions. WE(meaning those who areNOT biracial)only see ourselves as Black because THAT'S what they say we are, which is why whenever they pull their foot out of our asses, a little, we return to our NATURAL fractious/fragmented/non-cohesive/dis-unified inclinations.
As to, hunting down and tying biracials up trying to FORCE them to identify as Black, I wouldn't anymore do that, than I would try to force full blooded Negroes who don't want to identify as Black(we all know THAT doesn't happen), to do so. The whole putting biracials on a pedestal/or hating on them,thing doesn't trouble me: a. because I don't do it and the people who DO do it, are the ones who have the most trouble in that regard, b. if those who DO subscribe to that, stopped doing it, there wouldn't be a problem, c. MOST of the light skin exaltation or hating, that goes on in AMerica at least, is in reference to light skinned folks with TWO Black parents. Getting rid of biracials won't solve that problem. Those inclined towards self hate/exalting of others will find away to do that, no matter WHO is around, in my experience,furthermore, since when do folks who go that route(exalting/sexing/dating/marryinganything notphenotypically Black)care whether they are crossing some group line or not, ESPECIALLY, Black men,lol. That's like a woman with a unfaithful man feeling that banning all women from her house/environment will make her man keep his dick in his pants. Instead of accepting that HE has the problem and needs to control himself.
"Tina is aware that Ike passed away..... No further comment will be made."- Tina Turner's agent
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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,154
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Maryland (DC), USA
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imported post -
19-02-07, 07:51 PM
Fora biracial to flat out say.."I am white" would be complete suicide socially. If certain blacks didnt have inferiority complexes around "mixed" people they wouldnt find them hard to be around. If you act inferior around anyone they will see you as such.
The school of thought most here are subcribing to is a bit Nazish.
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Villager
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Posts: 172
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: , ,
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imported post -
19-02-07, 07:54 PM
No one needs white people to tell them their black. You can clearly see if you are black in contrast to someone who is white. No one can't tell the difference between many different African tribes. I can't point out someone who is Ashanti, Ewe, Hausa, etc..... However, I can tell the difference between a Scandinavian and someone who is Wolof. One is white and the other is black. White people didn't introduce this. This logic has been going on for a long time. Egyptians was able to tell themselves apart from outsiders. Sorry, white people didn't introduce this. This phenomenon can be seen with the naked eye with or without white people.
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Villager
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Posts: 172
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: , ,
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imported post -
19-02-07, 07:59 PM
A biracial person saying they are white is not bad. If a biracial is phenotypically white I think it is appropriate to indentify as such. Jennifer Beal is a good example. I think it is ludicrous for her to identify as black. I firmly believe it will do all of us a favor for them to choose to identify with a race and stay with it.
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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,110
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: USA
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imported post -
19-02-07, 08:04 PM
amononi wrote:
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No one needs white people to tell them their black. You can clearly see if you are black in contrast to someone who is white. No one can't tell the difference between many different African tribes. I can't point out someone who is Ashanti, Ewe, Hausa, etc..... However, I can tell the difference between a Scandinavian and someone who is Wolof. One is white and the other is black. White people didn't introduce this. This logic has been going on for a long time. Egyptians was able to tell themselves apart from outsiders. Sorry, white people didn't introduce this. This phenomenon can be seen with the naked eye with or without white people.
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No disagreement here. I'm referring to something more, however, than just knowing that u look different than a Scandanavian. I'm talking about a COLLECTIVE BLACK IDENTITY/WORLDVIEW. Black folks didn't have that UNTIL white folks FORCED THEM to have it. Some Black folks STILL don't have it,in spite of having white folks run roughshod over them for centuries. Sidney Poiter descirbed it best when explaining to Oprah the culture shock he experienced when coming from the Carribean to the U.S, as a young man. He said: "I knew I was Black in the sense that I didn't look like the white tourists I'd seen on my island, but I didn't know I was BLACK(meaning 2nd class citizenship/inferiority the main defining thing about u), until I got to America"
"Tina is aware that Ike passed away..... No further comment will be made."- Tina Turner's agent
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Villager
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Posts: 158
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
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imported post -
19-02-07, 08:44 PM
impactplayer wrote:
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If certain blacks didnt have inferiority complexes around "mixed" people they wouldnt find them hard to be around. If you act inferior around anyone they will see you as such.
The school of thought most here are subcribing to is a bit Nazish.
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Villager
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Posts: 158
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London
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imported post -
19-02-07, 08:49 PM
nikita wrote:
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To be honest I dont really trust them
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I have come across too many mixed race people who identify as black but think they are better because of their european features.
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That comment explains alot
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Villager
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Posts: 172
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: , ,
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imported post -
19-02-07, 09:20 PM
Gmahogany. wrote:
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amononi wrote:
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No one needs white people to tell them their black. You can clearly see if you are black in contrast to someone who is white. No one can't tell the difference between many different African tribes. I can't point out someone who is Ashanti, Ewe, Hausa, etc..... However, I can tell the difference between a Scandinavian and someone who is Wolof. One is white and the other is black. White people didn't introduce this. This logic has been going on for a long time. Egyptians was able to tell themselves apart from outsiders. Sorry, white people didn't introduce this. This phenomenon can be seen with the naked eye with or without white people.
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No disagreement here. I'm referring to something more, however, than just knowing that u look different than a Scandanavian. I'm talking about a COLLECTIVE BLACK IDENTITY/WORLDVIEW. Black folks didn't have that UNTIL white folks FORCED THEM to have it. Some Black folks STILL don't have it,in spite of having white folks run roughshod over them for centuries. Sidney Poiter descirbed it best when explaining to Oprah the culture shock he experienced when coming from the Carribean to the U.S, as a young man. He said: "I knew I was Black in the sense that I didn't look like the white tourists I'd seen on my island, but I didn't know I was BLACK(meaning 2nd class citizenship/inferiority the main defining thing about u), until I got to America"
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Okay I get. You are speaking of "class" in the U.S..
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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,764
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: In the heart of Africa
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imported post -
20-02-07, 12:37 AM
Gmahogany. wrote:
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YT sure did invent this shyt and since we feel it's not up to them to define us, why stop at biracials? Why not also assert that we recognize no racial category and stop calling ourselves Black or responding from that worldview?
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Well I don't like calling mysel black, that word is so negative, prefer african iin that case...
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Also since they invented this shyt and then decided that one drop of black or biracial=black, whom are we to say no ? After all this is their shyt (system)? It's funny that we are willing to accept some parts of their (vile)system, but not all. Though in my opinion it would be smarter to accept that which benefits us. This entire system isbased upon the absurd idea thatYT is pure and all else (in particular african/black)
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is dirty. The fact that some people insist upon making sense of something that DOESN'T make sense, sometimes baffles me, though I understand there is a need for it.
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Black folks outside of predominantly white countries don't see themselves as Black in the same way that Blacks in those societies have been forced to, ie as a cultural as well as biological identity(get miffed if you SAY THEY SHOULD, identify with someone not of their class JUST because they are "Black"). If white folks hadn't defined Black folks with TWO Black parents as Black, in AMerica, at least, we'd all still be running around hollering about being Ibo, Hausa, Mandinka, etc, disunified and at cross purposes.
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Geeh, I wonder why they don't see themselves as "black",they see themselves whatvere they are because they are. Some share immensly little culturally why they hell should they identify with those. Might as well call themselves dolphins. But alosYT didn't always know the difference...or care forthat matter. We were savages after all.
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There are various reasons for this as well, in Africathe euroes didn't want us to unify, so of course they promoted the opposite. This can be seen through they way, theyexalted africans with small noses and light complexion above those that lacked (the Rwanda massacre was an indirect product of this). But also as some tribes/peoples/etcnecities were given "better deals" (LOL)and encouraged to act malicously against fellow africans.
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As much as you might belivie that it's good to simply disregardones etnecity (be it Hausaor IGBO)and unify , you kill offcultural practices and tradition as well as language. This is why AA are closer to (YT)americans (in terms of culture), maybe even Euros than Africans. Byspreading thevarious africans in america they forced you abandon you cultures, what good is a languagewhen all people who speak it are spread over an entire continent. Of course mostof all you got punished if you spoke you language
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. Also in Africa a lot problemsare causedbecause we were seen as one big bunch of savages (by YT) and this lead to people of the same tribes/peoples/etcnecitiesbeing disunified and put on different sides of the borders (the euros wrote the borders reagrdless of us). We then had issues because of that. Off course if we all melted together as "black" we wouldn't have that issue. But what would we bethen ? Not the sameafricans I can tell ya. This is same problem with those muslims that talk about Khalifa as the ideal ruling type. Despite being unable to say whom the Khalifa should be (race, etnecity), for example (there are even more issues, but that's another topic).You payed a price for you so called"unifacation" and that was some partsof the cultureyou had in Africa (though Afro-america has astounding much left)...
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Oh and as far as I have heard/seen/know you are disunified and at cross purposes as things are now, so your forced "unification" means little...today.
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I would have prefered if it had come naturally rather than being forced, that way, people would simply turn non-black as early as oppurtunity rises.
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I agree that a so called unification has it's uses...
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Stop acting as if THAT identification has anything to do with our CHOICE/INCLINATION/DRUTHERS, it didn't and doesn't. You can see the truth of that in how hard it is to get FULL BLOODED "Black" folks from all around the world to see themselves as connected beyond all their various ethnic/tribal/cultural distinctions. WE(meaning those who areNOT biracial)only see ourselves as Black because THAT'S what they say we are, which is why whenever they pull their foot out of our asses, a little, we return to our NATURAL fractious/fragmented/non-cohesive/dis-unified inclinations.
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But that's the problem, you should not force people to do something or feel something they don't. Why because soon as as force that forces them temporarily disappears they will revert. It's the same with forcing a religioun, unless you are there all the time newly forced converts will revert back to whatver religioun. If it comes natural you won't. As matter of facts I couldn't give a flying **** (well a little maybe)if somebody considers himself african or not even though he/she has little or no non-african heritage. If he/shedoesn't want to I am not going to force them. Time will tell who is what. If somebody stands by africans/blacks even when thetides of racism are strongest and even then when they could pass for anything else, then I know who is African and who isn't.
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With that said, I am not claiming we choose to indentify this way in beginnnig, by all means YT forced upon us. BUT you choose toindentify as black american woman. NOT as an distantly mixed black woman. Some folks today choose todo so (indentify as mixed even though it was hundreds of years ago). We are not being forced in the same way any longer. And this can be seen through the amount of people who choose to indentify as other now. 50 years ago few biracials would claim to be biracial. According to the system they were black, there was not such thing as a half-white person. There was YT and there was non-YT. Today they do, because they have possibility too, they are not forced to be black any longer...in the same maner as in the past
As to, hunting down and tying biracials up trying to FORCE them to identify as Black, I wouldn't anymore do that, than I would try to force full blooded Negroes who don't want to identify as Black(we all know THAT doesn't happen), to do so. The whole putting biracials on a pedestal/or hating on them,thing doesn't trouble me: a. because I don't do it and the people who DO do it, are the ones who have the most trouble in that regard, b. if those who DO subscribe to that, stopped doing it, there wouldn't be a problem, c. MOST of the light skin exaltation or hating, that goes on in AMerica at least, is in reference to light skinned folks with TWO Black parents. Getting rid of biracials won't solve that problem. Those inclined towards self hate/exalting of others will find away to do that, no matter WHO is around, in my experience,furthermore, since when do folks who go that route(exalting/sexing/dating/marryinganything notphenotypically Black)care whether they are crossing some group line or not, ESPECIALLY, Black men,lol. That's like a woman with a unfaithful man feeling that banning all women from her house/environment will make her man keep his dick in his pants. Instead of accepting that HE has the problem and needs to control himself.
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You just had to get that somewhere there didn't you ? Woman, thou must not be tempted. I think you are inneed of some spanking, I will take upon myself to deliver this harsh task, as much as it might hurt MEsmoking-devil.
But since we are far from each other you can simply picture it in you mind, look at my Avatar for some hints...and let that be a lesson...for the Futureblkpokeblkrubhead
If beastiality is allowed on the BNV then why cant I post booty?-Black Power
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Villager Senior
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Posts: 1,110
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: USA
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imported post -
20-02-07, 07:19 AM
Dark Prince wrote:
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Gmahogany. wrote:
Quote:
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YT sure did invent this shyt and since we feel it's not up to them to define us, why stop at biracials? Why not also assert that we recognize no racial category and stop calling ourselves Black or responding from that worldview?
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Quote:
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Well I don't like calling mysel black, that word is so negative, prefer african iin that case...
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Also since they invented this shyt and then decided that one drop of black or biracial=black, whom are we to say no ? After all this is their shyt (system)? It's funny that we are willing to accept some parts of their (vile)system, but not all. Though in my opinion it would be smarter to accept that which benefits us. This entire system isbased upon the absurd idea thatYT is pure and all else (in particular african/black)
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is dirty. The fact that some people insist upon making sense of something that DOESN'T make sense, sometimes baffles me, though I understand there is a need for it.
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Quote:
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Black folks outside of predominantly white countries don't see themselves as Black in the same way that Blacks in those societies have been forced to, ie as a cultural as well as biological identity(get miffed if you SAY THEY SHOULD, identify with someone not of their class JUST because they are "Black"). If white folks hadn't defined Black folks with TWO Black parents as Black, in AMerica, at least, we'd all still be running around hollering about being Ibo, Hausa, Mandinka, etc, disunified and at cross purposes.
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Geeh, I wonder why they don't see themselves as "black",they see themselves whatvere they are because they are. Some share immensly little culturally why they hell should they identify with those. Might as well call themselves dolphins. But alosYT didn't always know the difference...or care forthat matter. We were savages after all.
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Quote:
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There are various reasons for this as well, in Africathe euroes didn't want us to unify, so of course they promoted the opposite. This can be seen through they way, theyexalted africans with small noses and light complexion above those that lacked (the Rwanda massacre was an indirect product of this). But also as some tribes/peoples/etcnecities were given "better deals" (LOL)and encouraged to act malicously against fellow africans.
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Quote:
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As much as you might belivie that it's good to simply disregardones etnecity (be it Hausaor IGBO)and unify , you kill offcultural practices and tradition as well as language. This is why AA are closer to (YT)americans (in terms of culture), maybe even Euros than Africans. Byspreading thevarious africans in america they forced you abandon you cultures, what good is a languagewhen all people who speak it are spread over an entire continent. Of course mostof all you got punished if you spoke you language
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. Also in Africa a lot problemsare causedbecause we were seen as one big bunch of savages (by YT) and this lead to people of the same tribes/peoples/etcnecitiesbeing disunified and put on different sides of the borders (the euros wrote the borders reagrdless of us). We then had issues because of that. Off course if we all melted together as "black" we wouldn't have that issue. But what would we bethen ? Not the sameafricans I can tell ya. This is same problem with those muslims that talk about Khalifa as the ideal ruling type. Despite being unable to say whom the Khalifa should be (race, etnecity), for example (there are even more issues, but that's another topic).You payed a price for you so called"unifacation" and that was some partsof the cultureyou had in Africa (though Afro-america has astounding much left)...
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Oh and as far as I have heard/seen/know you are disunified and at cross purposes as things are now, so your forced "unification" means little...today.
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I would have prefered if it had come naturally rather than being forced, that way, people would simply turn non-black as early as oppurtunity rises.
Quote:
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I agree that a so called unification has it's uses...
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Quote:
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Stop acting as if THAT identification has anything to do with our CHOICE/INCLINATION/DRUTHERS, it didn't and doesn't. You can see the truth of that in how hard it is to get FULL BLOODED "Black" folks from all around the world to see themselves as connected beyond all their various ethnic/tribal/cultural distinctions. WE(meaning those who areNOT biracial)only see ourselves as Black because THAT'S what they say we are, which is why whenever they pull their foot out of our asses, a little, we return to our NATURAL fractious/fragmented/non-cohesive/dis-unified inclinations.
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Quote:
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But that's the problem, you should not force people to do something or feel something they don't. Why because soon as as force that forces them temporarily disappears they will revert. It's the same with forcing a religioun, unless you are there all the time newly forced converts will revert back to whatver religioun. If it comes natural you won't. As matter of facts I couldn't give a flying f**k (well a little maybe)if somebody considers himself african or not even though he/she has little or no non-african heritage. If he/shedoesn't want to I am not going to force them. Time will tell who is what. If somebody stands by africans/blacks even when thetides of racism are strongest and even then when they could pass for anything else, then I know who is African and who isn't.
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Quote:
With that said, I am not claiming we choose to indentify this way in beginnnig, by all means YT forced upon us. BUT you choose toindentify as black american woman. NOT as an distantly mixed black woman. Some folks today choose todo so (indentify as mixed even though it was hundreds of years ago). We are not being forced in the same way any longer. And this can be seen through the amount of people who choose to indentify as other now. 50 years ago few biracials would claim to be biracial. According to the system they were black, there was not such thing as a half-white person. There was YT and there was non-YT. Today they do, because they have possibility too, they are not forced to be black any longer...in the same maner as in the past
As to, hunting down and tying biracials up trying to FORCE them to identify as Black, I wouldn't anymore do that, than I would try to force full blooded Negroes who don't want to identify as Black(we all know THAT doesn't happen), to do so. The whole putting biracials on a pedestal/or hating on them,thing doesn't trouble me: a. because I don't do it and the people who DO do it, are the ones who have the most trouble in that regard, b. if those who DO subscribe to that, stopped doing it, there wouldn't be a problem, c. MOST of the light skin exaltation or hating, that goes on in AMerica at least, is in reference to light skinned folks with TWO Black parents. Getting rid of biracials won't solve that problem. Those inclined towards self hate/exalting of others will find away to do that, no matter WHO is around, in my experience,furthermore, since when do folks who go that route(exalting/sexing/dating/marryinganything notphenotypically Black)care whether they are crossing some group line or not, ESPECIALLY, Black men,lol. That's like a woman with a unfaithful man feeling that banning all women from her house/environment will make her man keep his dick in his pants. Instead of accepting that HE has the problem and needs to control himself.
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You just had to get that somewhere there didn't you ? Woman, thou must not be tempted. I think you are inneed of some spanking, I will take upon myself to deliver this harsh task, as much as it might hurt MEsmoking-devil.
But since we are far from each other you can simply picture it in you mind, look at my Avatar for some hints...and let that be a lesson...for the Futureblkpokeblkrubhead
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Wow Dark Prince! That's the longest post I've ever seen from you. Lots of food for thought. I'm too tired to respond right now, I'll get back atcha in the am, nighty night...
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