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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 09:46 AM

Viewpoint: Tackling racism, head-on
By Rajiv Prabhakar

January 10, 2006
I spent the bulk of my life as a minority. When I was seven years old, my family and I moved to Singapore — a country where the majority of the population is Chinese. I lived in Singapore until two years ago, when I came to this country for college. Even though I have been living in countries where I was a minority for two-thirds of my life, I had never directly encountered racism. I used to believe that racism was an archaic idea that had died out decades ago along with slavery and colonialism. I did not doubt that racial stereotyping was widespread or that people have an innate tendency to favor those of their own race. But the idea of a person disliking someone purely because of his race seemed too barbaric to be true in today’s multicultural world. I placed more trust in the existence of Santa Claus than in the existence of people who support segregation.

Unfortunately, my belief in Santa Claus was once again shattered over the past semester. Several events didn’t help, such as the alleged incident where college students urinated on and hurled racial slurs at a group of Asians, or my own personal experience when I ran into some girls who did not want to stay too long in an area because “there are a lot of Arabs around here,� didn’t help. But those incidents were not what made me change my outlook on society.

A few months ago, my friend showed me a white supremacist website. I do not want to mention its name, but suffice it to say that it is wildly popular. Its forums attract close to 35,000 visitors every day, some of whom claim to be students at our University, who openly speak out against diversity, clamor for segregation, sling racial slurs of the worst kind and proclaim that whites are genetically superior to everyone else. Posts about eugenics, the holocaust being a hoax and Martin Luther King Jr. being a despicable person are nothing out of the ordinary. What is more frightening is that not all the forums there are based on politics or white supremacist philosophy. Visitors frequent the forums to discuss a range of topics from homemaking to music and entertainment. To them, white supremacy is not just a topic — it’s a community and a way of life.

It is easy to dismiss these white supremacists as uneducated and lacking in intelligence. But what frightened me the most was that the majority of them are hardly uneducated or lacking in intelligence. They are able to pen very intelligent and eloquent arguments to support their cause. They are able to cite credible statistics and evidence to back up their claims. What frightened me the most was that these people are, by most definitions, smart people, and yet they are firm believers in white supremacy. These people are hardly the stereotypical hicks that come to mind when picturing racists. These people could be your neighbors, your co-workers or even the people interviewing you when you apply for jobs.

Over the past semester, I realized that racism has by no means been vanquished. It has simply gone underground. In today’s media, saying something that is even slightly controversial on touchy issues often results in an enormous backlash and endless personal attacks. It is thus hardly surprising that no one dares to openly espouse white supremacist beliefs. This is unfortunate because the best way to tackle racism is not to censor it or to use straw-man arguments, but to fight it head-on. As much as I disagree with and personally dislike white supremacists, their arguments and beliefs should be more fairly represented in the media. I would love to see The New York Times give a columnist spot to a white supremacist just so his arguments supporting segregation and the superiority of the white race can be discussed and debunked by experts.

As things stand right now, someone who starts developing nascent racist beliefs has no avenue through which he can openly discuss his thoughts. He never sees his beliefs discussed or debated fairly in the media, either. As a result, his thoughts stay inside his head and continue to fester. One day, he might stumble across a white supremacist website where he encounters convincing, quasi-valid arguments backed up by statistics from credible sources. With nothing else to dissuade him, he would end up becoming a believer in white supremacy — this is a life story that is frequently narrated by numerous white supremacists. If these same arguments were discussed in the media, more convincing counter-arguments would be brought up that can more effectively persuade people that white supremacist beliefs are flawed.

I used to believe that racism doesn’t exist anymore. Now I realize that it not only exists, but is all around us — it is a major problem that society needs to continue addressing. But we can’t fight racism simply by being more politically correct, shouting down those who make perceived quasi-racist remarks or by censoring all racist opinions. Doing so will only drive it underground where we can’t fight it at all. The best way to fight racism is by allowing people the opportunity to engage in open discourse, even if it involves sensitive topics. It is time to bring racism out into the open where it is at its weakest.


Prabhakar is an Engineering junior and a member of the Daily’s editorial board.

http://www.michigandaily.com/vnews/d.../43c35cdfdfd55



The question is, would society benefit or suffer if racists were more out in the open (public) about their views instead of resorting to underground/internet exchange for their racist idealologies/suggestions and implications?



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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 10:04 AM

They only way I am concerned about rascism is how it affects me and my people close to me and their life.

The best way to fight racism is by allowing people the opportunity to engage in open discourse, even if it involves sensitive topics.

No the best way to fight racsim to make your community strong so that it is immunised from the effcts of racism.

The author seems to think that centuries old cultural traditions can be solved by open discourse.

DM

To answer your question I do not think it makes a blind bit of difference. It will not stop their views neither the manifestations of their beliefs. If racists are allowed to be more open with their views then its gving license for them to blatently disrespectour humanity. Better for them and me that they do that in private.
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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 10:08 AM

The authors argument mansamusa is that behind the scenes they organise and can affect us. As he says, they are the employers and teachers ect. Since they affect us in so profound a manner, can we really close our ears and pretend they don't exist? I think there is something to be said for smashing them in public. It won't change their ideas but slow down their recruitment surely?

I do agree with you though that the best way to defend against it is to be strong enough to be immunised against it. I mean economically and self determination wise not merely ideologically because it's in the practical sense that these things affect us.


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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 10:49 AM

Quote:


A few months ago, my friend showed me a white supremacist website. I do not want to mention its name, but suffice it to say that it is wildly popular. Its forums attract close to 35,000 visitors every day, some of whom claim to be students at our University, who openly speak out against diversity, clamor for segregation, sling racial slurs of the worst kind and proclaim that whites are genetically superior to everyone else. Posts about eugenics, the holocaust being a hoax and Martin Luther King Jr. being a despicable person are nothing out of the ordinary. What is more frightening is that not all the forums there are based on politics or white supremacist philosophy. Visitors frequent the forums to discuss a range of topics from homemaking to music and entertainment. To them, white supremacy is not just a topic — it’s a community and a way of life.
Quote:

It is easy to dismiss these white supremacists as uneducated and lacking in intelligence. But what frightened me the most was that the majority of them are hardly uneducated or lacking in intelligence. They are able to pen very intelligent and eloquent arguments to support their cause. They are able to cite credible statistics and evidence to back up their claims. What frightened me the most was that these people are, by most definitions, smart people, and yet they are firm believers in white supremacy. These people are hardly the stereotypical hicks that come to mind when picturing racists. These people could be your neighbors, your co-workers or even the people interviewing you when you apply for jobs.

Yep, we all know what website that is.....the majority of them may not be your average gap tooth, pot belly hillbillies that sleep with their cousins and go deer hunting in a 4x4, but it still doesn't surprise me nonetheless. Yes I know these people are my neighbours, teachersand co-workers etc but a lot of these people already manifest their bigotry in everyday life around me. Before the internet became what it was we used to say "you can imagine what whites discuss around the table with their families" but now they have the internet to espouse their views behind closed doors. The difference is they're 'speaking' to a larger group of people who are already bigoted to begin with...apart from that what else is new? confused3We have always been aware of their thinking processes from day one so it's no surprise or shock to us who have the displeasure of living the harsh realities around these people unlike yourself who used to live in la la land.....

Over the past semester, I realized that racism has by no means been vanquished. It has simply gone underground. In today’s media, saying something that is even slightly controversial on touchy issues often results in an enormous backlash and endless personal attacks. It is thus hardly surprising that no one dares to openly espouse white supremacist beliefs. This is unfortunate because the best way to tackle racism is not to censor it or to use straw-man arguments, but to fight it head-on. As much as I disagree with and personally dislike white supremacists, their arguments and beliefs should be more fairly represented in the media. I would love to see The New York Times give a columnist spot to a white supremacist just so his arguments supporting segregation and the superiority of the white race can be discussed and debunked by experts.

As things stand right now, someone who starts developing nascent racist beliefs has no avenue through which he can openly discuss his thoughts. He never sees his beliefs discussed or debated fairly in the media, either. As a result, his thoughts stay inside his head and continue to fester. One day, he might stumble across a white supremacist website where he encounters convincing, quasi-valid arguments backed up by statistics from credible sources. With nothing else to dissuade him, he would end up becoming a believer in white supremacy — this is a life story that is frequently narrated by numerous white supremacists. If these same arguments were discussed in the media, more convincing counter-arguments would be brought up that can more effectively persuade people that white supremacist beliefs are flawed.

I used to believe that racism doesn’t exist anymore. Now I realize that it not only exists, but is all around us — it is a major problem that society needs to continue addressing. But we can’t fight racism simply by being more politically correct, shouting down those who make perceived quasi-racist remarks or by censoring all racist opinions. Doing so will only drive it underground where we can’t fight it at all. The best way to fight racism is by allowing people the opportunity to engage in open discourse, even if it involves sensitive topics. It is time to bring racism out into the open where it is at its weakest.

Are you kidding me? That wouldn't achieve a damn thing. The only thing it would do is exacerbate the very sameproblem you hope to eradicate. Not too long ago in the last century people OPENLY stated their racist views which both went challenged and unchallenged and has anything changed for the better? NO! The only good thing I guess was that back in the old days (especially in England) you KNEW who your enemies were.

Also, don't you think that the media outlets are already saturated with white supremacy as it is (albeit subliminally)? What about all those journalists who already write columns and make programmes who very subtly promote a white supremacist ideology? What about those who, in 2006, still OPENLY attack the African community simply because they know they can do so with very little fear of any sort ofrepurcussions? How about those who exclude minorities (especially Africans) when it comes to important affairs that affect our way of living but only want to promote us when it comes to sports and music? How about those that only insist on portraying us in interracial relationships 9.9 times out of 10, when the other remainder shows African relationships as unstable and on the verge of breakdown? What about those who portray Africa to be one big huge slum who's only chance of survival is for the good ole western nations to swoop in like Superman and save it from it's demise? What about those who portray us as criminals? What about those who portray these bluefoot b**ches as beautiful with hair swaying from side to side because "their worth it?" thus indirectly telling African women that they're not beautiful? How about those who insist on manipulated historical documentaries to make it seem as if every single scientific achievement ever accomplished from day one has been because of the white man? How about films like King Kong? How about their stifling of the voices of Africans who attempt to tell THEIR side in anything that will at least have some kind of balance? Why DO they stifle us? You wanna know why........BECAUSE ALL THE MEDIA OUTLETS ARE ALREADYFILLED WITHWHITE SUPREMACY!! DUUH!!! Why do you think other groups all around the world place themselves in a hierarchy where the whites are on top, they're in the middle, and that we are at the very bottom? Don't you think the MEDIA has a huge role to play in that? Considering many of them have never even MET an African in their whole lives?

Just because they're not allowed to say "N****r" in public doesn't mean anything in the slightest. And the examples I've shown to you are only from one African man's persepective I'm sure other ethnic groups would have something similar to say but that's not my concern.

OUR voice in particular is stifled which is why many of these ignorants have their views in the first place. Think about it......


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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 11:22 AM

But then where do we get a chance to counteract the views of white racists. They go on indoctrinating their young ones in hatred and foolishness (have you seen lynx and lamb?) and those young ones have no access to the other side, our side.

Behind the scenes their kids learn all the stupid things on their site which we don't need to repeat and end up regurgitating it with gusto. Have you ever encountered these people on neutral debate forums? I have, and to see what they truly BELIEVE wholeheartedly is amazing. I'm not talking a small minority either.

Our voice is stifled even to us but then if some of us don't even know our side how on earth would anybody else?



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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 12:05 PM

DM

How can we have any control over what they teach their young? Whether they voice their feelings out in public or not what will that change. It that going to stop Mr. Director from passing you and me over for employment? Is it going to challenge the stereotypes that the majority of white people have of black people?

We're goin on like overt vocal racisim is the only type. We all know how it is embedded in institutions /media/ etc. and in the nations psyche. Or are you suggesting that through opendebate you can change a few minds and stem the tide?I think notunless we control the images/ history thatare presented to whites about Black people. Which aint gonna happen this century. As it serves a purpose and maintains the status quo.Racism is re-enforced all around us. Gagging a few loud mouths will not change anything. Way I see they are going to plan whatever they will plan. And any real plans/policy that they are serious about we will not be privvy to as people are not fools and if serious will not discuss their innermost strategy/plans on a public forum. Of course you will want to monitor their thoughts to gauge your enemy. But trying to change what white people already think of black people and are pre-disposed to thinking /hence them joining that site /is a waste of time/ energy and resources.

you wrote:

I do agree with you though that the best way to defend against it is to be strong enough to be immunised against it. I mean economically and self determination wise not merely ideologically because it's in the practical sense that these things affect us.


Exactly.


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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 12:40 PM

All this is an 'open' debate with a racist on another multi cultural forum....

Click here for link.

Now the obvious question here is who is this discourse benefitting the racist or the black & white participants attacking him?


African heart, African mind

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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 12:43 PM

DrunkMonkey wrote:
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But then where do we get a chance to counteract the views of white racists. They go on indoctrinating their young ones in hatred and foolishness (have you seen lynx and lamb?) and those young ones have no access to the other side, our side.

Behind the scenes their kids learn all the stupid things on their site which we don't need to repeat and end up regurgitating it with gusto. Have you ever encountered these people on neutral debate forums? I have, and to see what they truly BELIEVE wholeheartedly is amazing. I'm not talking a small minority either.

Our voice is stifled even to us but then if some of us don't even know our side how on earth would anybody else?

We just have to accept the fact that no matter what, racism will always be here. The europeanpsyche is very different to ours and rationale quite frankly isn't one of their best attributes by a long shot. Some of those who have access to our side are no better. For example sometimes I'm required to work in different parts of the country and even those who never have any form of association with us due to their location seem to have a bit more common sense than some clients in London who grew up in places like Hackney! It ain't gonna stop. Some of the questions they ask me are ridiculous for people who were exposed to African culture.
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I don't find their views "amazing" at all. You only have to listen to the Bergis audios I uploaded to realise that's how your average white thinks. It doesn't take much for them to manifest their racist views even in the most tranquil circumstances.....that's why I don't discuss 'race' issues with them anymore. I'm more interested in an educational outlet For Us By Us than educating any white person. We concentrate too much on giving pearls to swine than teaching ourselves sometimes.


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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 03:01 PM

The article is a good one and the recommendation is laudable. He has made very valid points. Political correctness pushes the issue of racism away from the eye of the public, but does nothing to stop racism itself. PC is nothing more than window dressing. If issues are brought to fore and discussed, superior arguments will always win. Then some (not all) of the kids that are being covertly being inculcated with racist values will have a basis of comparison to question what they have been told.
Whilst I agree it is not that simplistic, I also think we should give serious credence to such especially when the 'underground/background' activities still hurt us just as bad.


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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 03:29 PM

@DM sad to say our people suffer from a child like lack of understanding of social reality. Hence whites who make it clear they don't like black people are far more horrifying than those who do not. The system does not need people to talk that talk to harm us day in and day out and is like a silent machine. For example, a colleque of mine estimated half of black males have no business being in the legal justice system and ulitimately jail and racism and only racism is the prime cause. Policing and its institutionalised racism is like a silent machine, not about big dramas which involve people being killed, but silent everyday business as normal and part of professional working practice of every institution in this land.

The extreme right for all its embarrasing vulgarity is actually less damaging to black people, and in my assessment more beneficial given the simplicity of our people or too many of them.

I said in a discussion recently that I will vote for the BNP in the next election and I am not joking and you should have seen the faces of these people....Have any of them given any serious thought or done any serious work studying New Labour in any area of social policy or key areas? Nope. Do they understand the policy of patronage used by Blair more than any PM to appoint and honour prize Coons and its effects on us and white people..Nope..

Do they have any serious understanding of politics and strategy?...Ummm..Nope...So when I said giving your vote to any established party, particularly Labour, is still a wasted vote on what basis do they reject it...but they do.

It is this basic lack of anything which makes whites arrogant in the rule and dominance of us, for when a people are so child-like ruling and sh*tting on them does not even require work. When we are serious then we will realise only when we are prepared to play hard poker will people take us seriously.

The extreme right are an irrelevence.

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Post imported post - 13-01-06, 04:07 PM

FredB wrote:
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The extreme right are an irrelevence.
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Ain't that the truth!
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Furthermore, if anything they are a godsend to the ones who really do the damage "the liberal-smiling-faces" ones. You see we black people are so focussed and concerned with their exreme, foul mouthed rantings that we divert attention away from the ones throwing us the curve balls. I would challenge anyone to cite me a 'far-right-foul-mouth-racist' who has done Africans even a quarter of the damage done by the likes of the 'Freedom & Democracy God-fearing' brigade we come to know and love - such as New Labour (UK) or the Republican and Democratic parties of the US.
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The institutions and systems set in place to work against us will merrily chug along even if we were having 24 hour televised debates about Racism with white people and hearing what they 'really' felt. Damn, I already know what they really feel...............the evidence is all around me.