COZ asks sister to take the lead since the Black Male is failing. - Page 3

TheDogon · (#51 (**permalink**))

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Well, I dunno. What's the goal? Enpowerment for "Black" folks. . .or to prolong this struggle against the inevitable?

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I used to be a "lost" brotha. But I am no longer. I ain't great by any means, but I understand the situation much better than I used to. I figure it this way. If I, as big a sellout as I was, can figure out my place, my history, and my culture. Another brotha can do the same thing.

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But we can't get away from that collective responsbility. We simply do not teach this to our young ones coming up. In fact, I can't think of a situation in my youth, when a "Black" person sat me down and told me about my responsibility to my community.

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Mayhap, "Black" women just have this ingrained within them. It was an Native womn who once told me, "No nation is defeated until the hearts of it's women are on the ground". I think most women of color have this unique bond to their culture, at least as unique as a Mother to Child.

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But I think it's just not wise of us toexpect "Black" boys coming up will understand their culture on the intuitive level that "Black" girls/women do.

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Empowerment for Black folks is definitely the goal. The hope being that if sisters can maintain long enough, enough brothers can get on the same page and we can do the damn thing.If Black women give up, throw in thetowel,it will all be a mootpoint, and empowerment won't even be an option, down the line. There's nothing wrong with taking up each others slack. Being strongwhen the other person is weak and vice versa, but the sh*t has to an end/balance outat some point.In other words,I can carry the load when you're tired, but at some point if you don't take the load off of me, so I can rest, it's gonna be a problem,lol. Beyond that, if you let me become TOO accustomed to carrying the load alone, it may be hard toget back into team mode after a while, plus I'll resent you you for not pulling your weight, for so long. I think that, metaphorically, is what we see happening withus, to some degree. Once you get accustomed to not being able rely on someone, and having to do it all, it'shard to come out of that mode and trust and believe that u can relax and let that be. Some brothers WANT sisters to NEED them, and express that need rather than the "i can do it alone" mantra, not understanding where that mentality comes from. It comes from being let down, and left hanging.

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I heard Farrakhan give a speech about that very thing, once. He said you think BLack women WANT to carry the load alone? Of course they don't. That wears you out, no one can do it alone, but they've lost trust and faith in Black men to some degree. They feel like if THEY don't do it, it won't get done. He said Black women aren't stupid. If they feel that are dealing with a man they can trust and rely on, they will GLADLY let him handle things. He said, they know a fool or a clown when they see one, and just because they have sex/lay up with you does not mean that they respect or trust you enough to turn even the most basic decisions over to you. He said if a woman is constantly challenging you, verbally and arguing over the most minute decisions, that's her way of manifesting that she does not trust or respect you. Conversely, if she trusts and respects you(your intellect, character, morals, judgement,interest in her well being), she will DEFER to you, even if sheactually disagrees with you on something.

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I say Farrakhan is on to something,lol.

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Hey, I hear you. "Black" men have done much to complain about. And if sistas don't want them anymore, who could blame them? There are Asian males saying the same thing about Asian females right now. But if they want an Asian-American Community, they are going to have to forgive. Look at the IR disparity with Asian-American females. They outmarry 2.5 times as much as Asian-American males. You can reference debates anywhere within that community.

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And in truth, "Black" women, just like Asian males are part of the reasons for the issues. Because believe it or not, both groups are part of their respective communities.

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Remember, how we used to pretend that the problem was welfare queens? Remember that crap you would see on 20/20 or see in the newspapers? Well, the argument changed. It went to the "Black" poor. Yep, it isn't "Black" folks as a whole, it's the poor folks who have low morals. Now, it has moved to "Black" men.

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Well, racism should keep kicking the crap out of us until we get it. Just like it should keep kicking the crap out of the Asian-American Community until they get it.

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I do believe both communities will get it, eventually.

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We keep talking about the symptoms, but don't want to address the issue.

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The problem has been that the "Black" community has not wanted to mandate the behavior of it's members. We use individuality as our means for success while being in a racist society. Individuality works for "White" people. They can pretend to be individuals. But w

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e, "Black" folks,cannot do anything without consensus, as painful as that truth might be. Call it the "Black" tax.

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We will either learn to build a matrix for behavior/beliefs within our community or we will perish within the mythology that somehow, someway, "Whites" and other groups are superior to us. Because it is evident that no cultural group can exist while thinking itself inferior to other groupings.

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Societies in the end, choose to succeed or they choose to fail. I am pretty sure that in the end, we will choose success.

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It's just a matter of when we will do it.

TheDogon · (#52 (**permalink**))

safetyblitz wrote:

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DrunkMonkey wrote:

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I didn't mean wait for Bill to wave a magic wand and bring us a ready made microwave meal of a solution.

I meant get to discussing some here.

We all know the issues here, we've been around them over and over. Boring now. How to move forward...

DM

It seems like slavery or being held without rights is the only way to reach AA boys/men.

Once guys seem to lose their freedoms then their ears blossom from the head that is stuck up their rear ends (speaking from experience). I could lie to you and tell you that talking to an AA man gone AWOL would do you some good but until you put him in a situation where he has no choice to listen to you, he will not.

Getting shot does not even help as in it did not help me or others I knew....just encouraged the ignorance because I thought that I was damned near immortal.....

Unless the little guys have a someone to guide them on the correct path to manhood, they will stray. The pressure of the streets is stronger to them because the men and boys they see are pressing them to dumb down and become like them....selfish and unknowledged which is easier...

Everything else has been tried except AAs capturing other AAs tagging rehabbing them and releasing them, well besides the prisoners.

How do you establish the pride of the family back in the AA man when self indulgence has taken its place?

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I am not sure how many of the posters here are women, but little boys out in the street learn about manhood in that same place. That's why they shouldn't be out there in the first place. What do we do about so many children, among them "Black" boys, in the street?

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The last time a young brotha asked me for some money, I told him to bring his homework assignment the next day and I would.

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Gmahogany · (#53 (**permalink**))

Rockette wrote:

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Gmahogany wrote:

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I recommended that book,(maybe Time did too,not sure), and I particularly recommended the essay written by jazz singer/ actress Abbey Lincoln, called 'Who Will Revere the Black Woman?". You are right, this stuff has been a long time coming. It was quite predictable, actually. It's amazing how far back the seeds were planted, though. It had the same effect on me when I read it. She broke ish down, lovely; better than any psychologist/socioligist could have. Brought me to tears the first time I read it.

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They changed the name of that essay, but I've made photocopies for several women. There's another one which addresses the issue of men sitting there watching women work and carry the full load while they stubbornly refuse to step up called "Dear Black Man". Every last one of these essays are on point today! I plan to contact Abbey Lincoln since she lives in NY. I'd like to know how she feels about the state of affairs in 2006. I had already heard of the Anthology but never realized how powerful it was until you mentioned Abbey's essay and it stayed with me.

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Good idea,I'm sure she has plenty tosay. I think Black women intuitively sensed/sense a lot of stuff before brothers did/do.The mistake we made, is not trusting that intuition and taking a stand on it. We allowed the Black agenda in general to be defined as a Black male agenda, as if Black women weren't alsoBlack. There was/is to some extent this underlying feeling that only Black men experience/suffer from racism, Black women have been over here having a phucking ball for 5 centuries,lol. You even have the old school saying that some Black men STILL recite/believe, "the 2 freeest people on earth are the white man and the Black woman" We allowed that kind of asinine logic to cower us andchoose not to make waves forfear of beingaccused of being in cahoots with Mr. Charlie, or horror of horrors being accused of being a feminist,lol. Meanwhile, as Ms. Lincoln's essay points out, some Black men have been running to white women and talking shit about Black women, and Black people in general,going back at least to the 30's and 40's and throwing the whole race under the bus in the process.

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In spite of this, Our loyalty was always up for scrutiny, while Brothers loyalty wasn't, in many instances, even when it should have been.

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Our going along with the programwas understandable really, because white racism had stripped Black men's manhood so much, and it was felt thatIT had to be restored at all costs, which is cool, except that it caused a certain inbalance and overcompensation on Black women'sparts, in some instances....cosigning ish that we should have never been cosigining, giving a pass on a lot of things things; that ultimately was not good forBlack men themselves, or for the rest of us, as a collective.

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Prince Hakeem · (#54 (**permalink**))

Has anyone read this book by any chance:

Just wondering.......

Vubundada_Kandaba · (#55 (**permalink**))

I agree with Bill Cosby. He is telling it like it is; and like some people say, the "truth hurts when it is told". I don't see why people are all up in arms with what Bill Cosby is saying. You really have to come to America and visit the ghettos, the prisons, the the inner city high schools to see what Cosby is saying. Go to any major university and see how many blacks students there are. During my days in college in all of my classes, if there were 10 black students, then 7-9 are women. You begin to ask yourself were are the men.

Lucas... · (#56 (**permalink**))

@gmahagony
mmmmm ...feminist or not.... you definetly are passionate about this and subjects of this kind....
ok i dont live in the states... but the way y'all are coming is aross is like the brothas over there are "fluff" not the picture i had painted in my mind.. at all

anyone got any true "statistics" (and i use the term true loosly here)of how and in what areas... brothas are supposed to be failing?

Vubundada_Kandaba · (#57 (**permalink**))

Reading through all the Bill Cosby threads in the past and this current one, I can't help but notice a trend. Those of us (In Blacknet village)who live in America are all in support of Bill Cosby because we have seen what is happening in the black community. It seems like our cousins over in the UK are the ones getting upset with his speech. You guys really need to come over here and see exactly what Cosby is saying. It is time some-one like Cosby stands up. Sugar-coating words is not going to help. Go to the universities and see how many black males are there. For each 10 black students, 7-8 are women. So if the men are not stepping up and taking charge, then the women should do the leading.

Gmahogany · (#58 (**permalink**))

Lucas... wrote:

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@gmahagony
mmmmm ...feminist or not.... you definetly are passionate about this and subjects of this kind....
ok i dont live in the states... but the way y'all are coming is aross is like the brothas over there are "fluff" not the picture i had painted in my mind.. at all

anyone got any true "statistics" (and i use the term true loosly here)of how and in what areas... brothas are supposed to be failing?

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I'm passionate in general, Lucas. Especially about things that affect Black folks.

Gmahogany · (#59 (**permalink**))

Rockette wrote:

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Vubundada_Kandaba wrote:

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Reading through all the Bill Cosby threads in the past and this current one, I can't help but notice a trend. Those of us (In Blacknet village)who live in America are all in support of Bill Cosby because we have seen what is happening in the black community. It seems like our cousins over in the UK are the ones getting upset with his speech. You guys really need to come over here and see exactly what Cosby is saying. It is time some-one like Cosby stands up. Sugar-coating words is not going to help. Go to the universities and see how many black males are there. For each 10 black students, 7-8 are women. So if the men are not stepping up and taking charge, then the women should do the leading.

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It's difficult for them to get the full picture especially since they "appear" even more divided than we are. I heard that Black Brits are 3% of the population in the UK but roughly 50% of them are with nonblack women and completely shut black women out. That speaks volumes right there about them letting their own community down. This was written by an African man who lives in the UK who has admitted he has no love for any woman black.

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Are you a whitophile?

Is there something about the sight of a womans white-skinned body that just brings some sort of animal up out of you from like... the deep deep down?

Does the look of a naked white body, long and slender and pale, sprawled across the bed of your darkened room and shinning in the moonlight coming through the window make your fingers wiggle greedily and your tongue hang out?

Does the look of a perfect alabaster-white ass like a vision sculptured in marble (except soft and warm instead of hard and cold) pushing toward your face make you want to kneel in drooling worship? Does a patch of pale white skin glimpsed through ripped denim jeans transfix you? Could you stroke a stream of blonde peach-fuzz hair that flows down the groove of an egg-shell colored spine to dissapear between pearly white ass-cheeks for hour after loving hour?

Could you actually count all the freckles on a natural redhead female, and then count them again just to be sure- stopping every now and then to marvel at the milky white skin on the bottomeside of her forearms and ass-cheeks where freckles don't occur?

Do you sometimes catch sight of a slender white hand the color of candle-wax emerging from a black sleeve reaching acro