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Default Tribal War In Kenya, Gang Warfare In L.a. - 31-01-08, 04:15 PM

I was watching Hotel Rwanda with a group of friends one night and the conversation turned to why the Hutus and Tutsis were chopping each other up. One dude was very critical of the Africans, bordering on contempt.
But other cats challenged him, pointing out that we do the same thing over here, with the Bloods and Crips.
“It’s not the same thing,” he said.
“It’s the same shit,” they fired back. It was like five against one, so he shut up and didn’t say any more.

Ethnic bloodletting in Kenya and political violence in Kingston, Jamaica. Crippin’ in L.A., bangin’ in Chicago and D.C., armed teenage gangs terrorizing Liberia and Sierra Leone.

It’s because we tend to compartmentalize world news that we’re caught sleeping by catastrophic events, painfully reminded that it’s one world and everything is connected.

One common thread runs through the war in Iraq, the “war on crime”
in urban African American neighborhoods, (read, “high crime areas”) and civil wars in Africa. Profits. Huge profits.

Vital natural resources are cheaper, easier to exploit in the chaos of war. Not to mention arms sales. The more “factions” the better. It might just be a coincidence that Africa’s hottest spots are always where the diamonds, petroleum, uranium and other minerals are. Might be, sure.

Might be that the Congo is hot simply because of tribalism. That the country’s astounding mineral wealth, its legacy of colonialism, arbitrary borders and King Leopold is just an excuse. It’s the Congolese who are actually killing Congolese, isn’t it? Tribal warfare is after all synonymous with Africa and has always been, right? Except we don’t really know that. As far as can be proven by historical fact, tribal warfare began with European/Arab contact.

Could be that the prison industry is booming and full of African American males simply because they’re criminals, too stupid to stop slaughtering each other over trivial shit. So what criminal justice is the fastest growing field, that prisons are slave labor camps where military hardware and uniforms, aircraft parts and office furniture are manufactured, and the economic mainstay of rural communities that thrive off the mayhem in the ghetto? Might be all that’s just an excuse for people who choose to commit crimes. Might be, sure.

It’s just possible that the PNP-Laborite violence in the streets of Kingston is simply a Jamaican problem. That it’s only coincidence that this bloody rivalry began when the socialist-leaning government of Michael Manley came to power. Possible, sure.

Might be that Africa’s oldest republic and at one time its most stable nation was destroyed because of the ethnic minority oppression of the indigenous people by the African American founders of the country. The fact that she was an African success story with considerable influence in the Third World had nothing to do with her destruction, did it? Or the fact that her traditionally American-allied government was suddenly asserting its non-alignment and its African-ness, challenging western capitalist interests. Surely it’s crazy to suggest that Liberia’s objection to the use of its territory for arms shipments to UNITA in Angola had more to do with its destruction than any imaginary “Americo-Liberian” oppression? Could be, sure.

Who cares anyway? Most African Americans have never even heard of Liberia, a part of their own history, nor do they know that their high standard of living depends on wars in such countries.

Could be mere coincidence that another stable and successful African nation, Kenya is now being destabilized by ethnic violence. It really doesn’t matter what outside interests are involved behind the scenes, does it? The Kenyans are just savages, right? Bunch of psychotic morons, surely? Could be, sure.

It’s simply coincidence isn’t it, that crime and violence exploded in the ghettos only after the elimination of key leaders like King, Malcolm and the Kennedys, the neutralization of groups like the Panthers and the BLA, the flight of jobs and the middle class from the inner city? Nobody really planned all that, did they?

The fact that Los Angeles and the Bay Area were hotbeds of African American revolutionary-intellectual activism surely had nothing to do with the creation of the Crips and Bloods, does it? The systematic elimination of the revolutionary leadership by COINTELPRO didn’t directly produce gangbangers, did it? Surely that’s a baseless “conspiracy theory?” Perhaps.

The idea that there’s a group of people in a smoke-filled room somewhere plotting the destabilization of successful African countries, the elimination of idealistic leaders who dare challenge capitalist interests, and the flood of guns, illicit drugs and gangs into African and African American urban centers is preposterous, isn’t it? Surely the blame for Black-on-Black violence falls squarely on Africans themselves, doesn't it?

Maybe. Except that, like the cops, I don’t believe in coincidence. Whatever that is.

Do you?


The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.
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Default 31-01-08, 08:32 PM

Omoshango wrote:
I was watching Hotel Rwanda with a group of friends one night and the conversation turned to why the Hutus and Tutsis were chopping each other up. One dude was very critical of the Africans, bordering on contempt.
But other cats challenged him, pointing out that we do the same thing over here, with the Bloods and Crips.
“It’s not the same thing,” he said.
“It’s the same shit,” they fired back. It was like five against one, so he shut up and didn’t say any more.


Wow! Let me begin by saying that this is one heavy piece you have written. Thank you. It really made me think.

The whole idea that gang violence and “tribalism” or ethnic conflict bear striking similarities had never even occurred to me. But, now that you have mentioned it, I do see some superficial similarities.

Ethnic Conflict:
It seems that what lies at the core of ethnic conflict in Africa is the fact that one ethnic group feels slighted by another. For example, in Kenya, the British favored one ethnic group over all others (the Kikuyu, I believe). The British gave this group a disproportionate share of land. The other groups were never happy about this and now, in the wake of elections, the colonialist generated tension has boiled over. The groups feel as though their futures are in jeopardy and they spill blood to voice their opposition.

Gang Violence:
Interestingly enough, it just occurred to me, that gangs also initiate conflict due to issues of land and territory. Still, gangs in California seem to operate more from a spirit of intimidation and coercion than from one born of a fear of being overrun by another group. Also, the high incarceration rates of Black men through the sixties and seventies also fueled the rise of Black and Latino gangs. These gangs were so critical to survival within prison walls that their influence extended to city streets. On the other side of the argument, the way the gang members are loyal to the gang, even unto death, and the unexplainable rage gang members feel toward other gangs seems reminiscent of the ethnic conflict we see in Africa.

Okay, I am obviously kind of rambling and just trying to flesh this issue out. I would be interested to hear some other views on this topic.



Omoshango wrote:
The idea that there’s a group of people in a smoke-filled room somewhere plotting the destabilization of successful African countries, the elimination of idealistic leaders who dare challenge capitalist interests, and the flood of guns, illicit drugs and gangs into African and African American urban centers is preposterous, isn’t it? Surely the blame for Black-on-Black violence falls squarely on Africans themselves, doesn't it?

Conspiracy?
This last paragraph kind of bothers me. I am not a conspiracy theorist but neither am I of the opposite end of the spectrum who believe that Blacks are to blame for all of their problems. I come from a camp of thinkers who believe that a host of problems suffered by Blacks today come from at least three sources:

A) The inertial effects of global White Supremacy institutionalized by Colonilaism, Racism, Economic exploitation and the blatant mis-education of the Black people all over the world. By inertia, I mean to suggest (and this point is critical) that even if white people were to cease all racist practices today, the sheer force behind the polices and practices set into places centuries ago, are heavy enough to oppress Blacks for another 1000 years. For example, when a speeding train applies the brakes we all know that it may need a lot of additional train track to come to a complete halt. Hence, “inertia.” Yes, this view necessarily includes a conclusion that most whites are not actively complicit in a campaign to oppress Blacks but, rather, they are benefiting from the policies their ancestors instituted to oppress Blacks.

B) Cultural Corruption: This argument is grounded in the belief that your culture is your source of strength and includes problems such as, the transition from being a culture once grounded in orality (i.e., oral tradition) to a culture trying to embrace literacy. It also includes the problems stemming from the fact that African minds conduct business through foreign (European) cultural frames (just picture Black Kenyan judges wearing white-curly Euro wigs on their heads while administering Euro type law and my point becomes clear).

C) A & B are sufficient to stymie the development of any group but we must also add to this a healthy dose of self-criticism. We have done a horrible job of sticking together, harnessing our resources and developing solutions. Yes, A & B may be the cause of C but we just do not know to what extent.

My problem with the conspiracy theory is this: if we continue to look for the smoke-filled room we will waste resources that could be used to develop organic solutions to our problems. As I evaluate our condition with a critical lens grounded in Africana Social Theory, I am coming to the conclusion that the strong belief in Black communities that we are victims of some kind of conspiracy is an integral part of “A” mentioned above: The inertial affects of global White Supremacy and more specifically, the residual psychological effects of slavery. Psychologist William V. Hardy (Columbia University) would say that 400 hundred years of oppression has produced a kind of clinical paranoia that is present in the personalities of millions of Africans but that remains undiagnosed because the concept of what paranoia is, is grounded in themes of white-oppressor mental health.

What are your thoughts?

Thank you for reading?

Holla!

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Default 01-02-08, 03:55 AM

sup cousin,

Big post. Speaking of home..going to visit anytime soon?


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Default 01-02-08, 04:21 AM

It is the same. I was born a Bounty Hunter and had to travel all the way to Somalia to watch some other kids going through the same shit I went through in LA.

Being born in one fight and witnessing another first hand all I can say is that it is the same.
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Default 01-02-08, 05:01 AM

For real, watched that Hotel Rwanda film with a sista and had to make excuse to go to the bathroom to wipe up the eyes. That was horrible and made me ask whether as a people we need more films like these. But I've learned a serious lesson, where we believe these films are to enlighten us, many of us watch them and it only inflates the existing internal hatred we have for each other i.e. some would watch these films as the stimulant or the adrenalin rush they need to go and slay their own kind.

A relative of mine watched that Goodbye Uncle Tom film and all he saw was Africans selling out each other with the white man sitting relaxing in the background. He went on to say he hates an African which told me the film only fueled an existing ingrained prejudice - how long do you think it takes to unwash a brain like this before it is anywhere near ready for the battle...and how far on has the battle moved by the time that mind is ready. We're forever playing catchup, and we'll never get there. As the relative said, f**k Africa and all that sh!t, it's all about survival, he'll go into a runnings with a white man if he makes money with it...probably feel no way to sell out a brotha during that process.

But politically, for me it's all related to poverty, financial for most and of the mind for many. Africa and africans have always been the scapegoats for this negativity when in reality you look throughout the world in Jerusalem, Iraq, Bosnia and dare I say anywhere where the West has its Capitalist fingers then the image is the same.

I will never deny the fact that we as Africans have specific issues, and for a large part our plight appears to be magnified because of these, this is no different in the opposite direction where like Chris Rock says about the white dentist who can afford to live in the same area as some of the richest black superstars in the US, a black man has to fly to reach the same place a white man can walk to...so again, our plight is simply magnified, irrespective of the battlefielfd.

So yeah, we do have issues, but this political bloodshed that is happening in Kenya to me is no different to the political battles anywhere else in the world. You only think it is when you see yourself in the same way the rest of the world does, black. Kenyans were living relatively peaceful before the elections. Poverty, even worse when you are poor and you believe someone has stolen your land.

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Default 01-02-08, 12:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omoshango View Post

Ethnic bloodletting in Kenya and political violence in Kingston, Jamaica. Crippin’ in L.A., bangin’ in Chicago and D.C., armed teenage gangs terrorizing Liberia and Sierra Leone.

It’s because we tend to compartmentalize world news that we’re caught sleeping by catastrophic events, painfully reminded that it’s one world and everything is connected.

One common thread runs through the war in Iraq, the “war on crime”
in urban African American neighborhoods, (read, “high crime areas”) and civil wars in Africa. Profits. Huge profits.

Vital natural resources are cheaper, easier to exploit in the chaos of war. Not to mention arms sales. The more “factions” the better. It might just be a coincidence that Africa’s hottest spots are always where the diamonds, petroleum, uranium and other minerals are. Might be, sure.

Might be that the Congo is hot simply because of tribalism. That the country’s astounding mineral wealth, its legacy of colonialism, arbitrary borders and King Leopold is just an excuse. It’s the Congolese who are actually killing Congolese, isn’t it? Tribal warfare is after all synonymous with Africa and has always been, right? Except we don’t really know that. As far as can be proven by historical fact, tribal warfare began with European/Arab contact.

Could be that the prison industry is booming and full of African American males simply because they’re criminals, too stupid to stop slaughtering each other over trivial shit. So what criminal justice is the fastest growing field, that prisons are slave labor camps where military hardware and uniforms, aircraft parts and office furniture are manufactured, and the economic mainstay of rural communities that thrive off the mayhem in the ghetto? Might be all that’s just an excuse for people who choose to commit crimes. Might be, sure.

It’s just possible that the PNP-Laborite violence in the streets of Kingston is simply a Jamaican problem. That it’s only coincidence that this bloody rivalry began when the socialist-leaning government of Michael Manley came to power. Possible, sure.

Might be that Africa’s oldest republic and at one time its most stable nation was destroyed because of the ethnic minority oppression of the indigenous people by the African American founders of the country. The fact that she was an African success story with considerable influence in the Third World had nothing to do with her destruction, did it? Or the fact that her traditionally American-allied government was suddenly asserting its non-alignment and its African-ness, challenging western capitalist interests. Surely it’s crazy to suggest that Liberia’s objection to the use of its territory for arms shipments to UNITA in Angola had more to do with its destruction than any imaginary “Americo-Liberian” oppression? Could be, sure.

Who cares anyway? Most African Americans have never even heard of Liberia, a part of their own history, nor do they know that their high standard of living depends on wars in such countries.

Could be mere coincidence that another stable and successful African nation, Kenya is now being destabilized by ethnic violence. It really doesn’t matter what outside interests are involved behind the scenes, does it? The Kenyans are just savages, right? Bunch of psychotic morons, surely? Could be, sure.

It’s simply coincidence isn’t it, that crime and violence exploded in the ghettos only after the elimination of key leaders like King, Malcolm and the Kennedys, the neutralization of groups like the Panthers and the BLA, the flight of jobs and the middle class from the inner city? Nobody really planned all that, did they?

The fact that Los Angeles and the Bay Area were hotbeds of African American revolutionary-intellectual activism surely had nothing to do with the creation of the Crips and Bloods, does it? The systematic elimination of the revolutionary leadership by COINTELPRO didn’t directly produce gangbangers, did it? Surely that’s a baseless “conspiracy theory?” Perhaps.

The idea that there’s a group of people in a smoke-filled room somewhere plotting the destabilization of successful African countries, the elimination of idealistic leaders who dare challenge capitalist interests, and the flood of guns, illicit drugs and gangs into African and African American urban centers is preposterous, isn’t it? Surely the blame for Black-on-Black violence falls squarely on Africans themselves, doesn't it?

Maybe. Except that, like the cops, I don’t believe in coincidence. Whatever that is.

Do you?

Absolutely brilliant...Got to be the post of the year. Have to say when I saw the title the other day I was not inspired to read it, although I saw the connection wasn't sure where the author was going with it. But all I can say is WOW!
IF you are new to these boards let me just say welcome and I look forward to reading more of your posts.

Brilliant.


If we do not have an accurate analysis of the problem, we cannot possibly develop a good strategy to resolve it.
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Default 01-02-08, 06:16 PM

Omoshango wrote:
It’s simply coincidence isn’t it, that crime and violence exploded in the ghettos only after the elimination of key leaders like King, Malcolm and the Kennedys, the neutralization of groups like the Panthers and the BLA, the flight of jobs and the middle class from the inner city? Nobody really planned all that, did they?


Yes, and this was my point in a not so popular thread I started a few days ago entitled, “Return of the Black Alpha Male.” By ‘alpha male’ I mean to reference an anthropological expression used to describe the strong male leader of primate groups. You may have heard this expression used in relationship to leaders such as Bill Clinton and Al Gore. Bill, according to cultural critics, was more of an alpha male type, exhibiting all of the signs of a tenacious leader who, if necessary, would attack the competition in order to stay in power. Gore, on the other hand, was/is a Beta Male. He is a natural number two type who wants to be a number one, but lacks the charisma to achieve it. You can repress a cultural group for hundreds of years by simply identifying and killing their alpha males or females. This was a common practice during slavery, proud charismatic Africans, or slaves arriving from the West Indies, were routinely killed or maimed in order to control the morale of the other slaves. In the post slavery era, our Alphas rose up again, but sadly by 1970, they had all been killed, maimed or imprisoned once again.

The conventional wisdom is that the sixties and early seventies were simply a special politically charged time of American history; Blacks pressed for civil rights, whites let their hair grow long, experimented with drugs and listened to rock & roll (Blacks as well), and protest was a social norm in the country. White controlled school textbooks have it all wrong. It was always Blacks who sparked the protest within other groups. They rode piggyback on a social/ethnic progression that had been occurring every 50 or so years within Black communities. After centuries of killing our Alpha Male/Female leaders, they were on the rise again. Their deaths, in my opinion, may have resulted in another politically dormant chapter of African American history. We are living this chapter. Nonetheless, I am of the mind that the evolution of the cycle favors us once again. Also, due to the information age, knowledge, “consciousness” is you will, is spreading again, the Alphas are returning and that we are headed into a new chapter of political activism. I do not just believe this to be so; I am living to make it so.

White Supremacy had to keep killing our leaders, it was a well-known colonial practice. Stalin and the Khmer Rouge also used it with great success. Today, the military junta ruling the country known as Myanmar uses is with great effect by killing and imprisoning Buddhist monks. We do our children a great dishonor by not teaching this as a standard part of an African American of Diasporic history. How can they stop what they do not understand?


Holla!

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Default 01-02-08, 08:45 PM

the passing on of the correct account, as well as the strategy of survival of as much the alpha types as the whole group also depends, unfortunately, on the alphas, Neferkare, and herein lies the destructive force of the tactic of rooting them out. it basically leaves the group brainless, so to say, meaning the Alphas whose generation manages to survive, then free Africans from this oppression, will have to have mastered the art of evading and escaping the worst the west has in store for them. Alpha males are eliminated silently... so that alphas-to-be, or the community at large, are not warned until it is their turn to die, when it is too late.

Romans also used the tactic, and to great effect too. i outline how they deliberately kept the German tribes disunited, self hating, and used their own kind to control them, in my post here. guess who these traitors were bound to clash with first... German Alpha males, whom they would get rid of expeditiously what with the might of Rome behind them. this same process is ongoing in Africa, and happens to be what is keeping Africa behind in today's world as fellow blacks are better at identifying and eliminating these types than the west could ever be...

comes with the territory.

I do not know how this problem can be resolved in the Diaspora where Africans are surrounded, trapped behind enemy lines, but in Africa, one sure way is dedicating our efforts towards Pan-Africanism. Unifying the a continent decentralized along tribal lines will take away the capacity of foreign powers to manipulate Africans against each other. Nobody will have cause to pick a fight with another on account of tribe because they will live in their own territory.
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vex 01-02-08, 08:56 PM

why oh Why...Kenya was one place i thought was beyond the tribalism sh*t....its those dirty politicians stirring things up as usual this people have been iving side by side for x amount of years well until they have been brainwashed about the other tribe would do so and so...
A friend of mine a kenyan this was what he had this to say

Sad but very true, it's an ethnic thing that's going on in Kenya.....

Kibaki is good for the country & has made Kenya a stronger (economically & socially) since he begun running the country.

Odinga is EXTREMELY power hungry and aligns himself to any political party that might win, this time he ran his own presidential campaign.
Odinga had stated before the election that people from his ethnic group should not pay rent in the slums (or any poor people anywhere in Kenya) therefore the turmoil begun to unfold from this irresponsible statement amongst other statements he made.

Odinga's family have been a thorn in Kenya's history even back in the 1950's & 60's his dad was aligned to communism and was advocating for Kenya to be a communist state. He was Kenyatta's vice president but was sacked for his radical interests. His son Odinga who is now asking for Kibaki to step down was educated in Eastern Germany so you can see his inkling.

Odinga is too power hungry to understand the mechanisms of a nations governance or it's peace. He has caused Kenya to have social issues that could easily lead Kenya to experience the Rwandese situation.

Odinga was also responsible & jailed for Kenya's attempted coup in 1982 !

@Omoshango
Brilliant piece...its no coincidence but do our people listen they instead take the high road and blame Africans and other Blacks around the world...as @Nkerefre also noted the damage and brainwashing that had been put in place by YT people would take hundreds of years to unravel...YT people always plan for a 100-1000 years in advance this is how they strategize if in doubt go ask in Gilbraltar what they think of their cousins the English
How can relatively peaceful places like Ivory Coast-Rwanda-Liberia-Sierra Leone-kenya and i know this for a fact places beyond the tribalistic stuff that festers in places like Nigeria become a killing field its like seeing Ghana go that way in a few years thats how absurd it is
I have always thought why the places with minerals Nigeria-Congo-Angola-Sierra Leone to name a few or those against western imperialism like Somalia??..


one will need a bigger lie to cover the first one

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