Talk about shallow interpretation...protection to buy a patty LOL

Incognito - you are too dam facety! I am aware it is not just about the pattie - I sympathised with the whole of your post but I dont feel the need to waffle as much as you do... you do go on a bit dont you??

How much I go on is irrelevant as the fundamental will never change, that fundamental being you cannot fit a 5x4 plan into a 2x3 brain - therefore regardless of how much I go on, or not go on, that ratio between the deliverer and the receiver will always be the same

kool nuh sis...you nuh see sun a' shine...

I am feeling very cool today thank you, otherwise I would have cuss you off properly....

...man o man, another admirer

"Where we failed as a community". What kind of safety nets would you suggest should of been built. Who should of built them? Our generation (first generation) or our parents from the carribean. The reason I say this is because the continental African community are being socialised in British thinking within a 10 year period if you look at all the Somalian / West/Central African youths you hear in the news in places likie Peckam/Camberwell etc which now outnumber immigrants from the carribean in those areas. What happened to their cultural values in such a short space of time.

BTW desentised. Yep afraid its happened already for me. If you mean there is no sense of shock or outrage when I hear another tenneage murder then yes Ive been worked over.

BT - I look to those who have been saved by safety nets such as the church, prison, medication, strength in family, mentors etc but too many have been caught in the disaster....which safety net it takes to catch the crop of these is the proverbial question which for me, the fact that we still ask 'what kind of safety net should be built and by whom' is the failure itself i.e. it's the fact that we don't yet know as opposed to the fact that we haven't.

Personally, when I look at this generation of youth the one thing that is clear is they are exposed to a lot more than we were. We were lucky to see black people on television, this lot have bling and sex thrown in their face. We were told to be doctors, lawyers and accountants, why would anyone want to do that now when they can achieves ten times as much as a rapper. If we were lucky we saw a p0rn magazine discarded on the road with some white women skinning out their reds, had to look to the top shelf at the local newsagent and dream, now the music industry and the internet shows black p0rn with black women skinning out for nickels.

If I look to other races then the safety net is still in culture where exposure to what the west has to offer is subdued. Those who have come from war torn countries where their parents and families have been slaughtered have lost all faith in 'culture' years ago...that's a different argument.

Anyone with the mindset that life now is all about survival is easy prey to western hype, in this sense we have failed because we have no unity, trust has to be earned as opposed to assumed, when I say we have failed, the failure is there is no we.

BT - should also say each new killing hits me like the first.

Incognito

Plenty to ponder on. Bro when you say its all about survival thats how I see it now. As we can observe there is no "we". Was there even a "we" 20-30 years ago or was it a we based on superficial terms..because for all the talk about shows of unity etc. back in the 70s and 80s (not even touching windrush era) wtf or rather where has it brought us now. Its not pretty out there at all. Even on a personal level Ive offered the idea among my friends about getting our sons together and starting a unoffiocial programme of guidnce /education etc. but for all the pretty talk apathy is there like a sloth in the night. I see my brother succesfully negotiate two sons through the madness. If its one thing he's done is kept them busy virtually every day of the week doing some activity in controlled environments. So their time "on road" has been limited. Nowhere near the time I and you probably spent on road in our youth.

Call me naive but I beleive that this shit can be controlled in my immediate environment via similar and other methods. When I talk survival I mean giving my boy skills and thought processes that many of the youth dont have out there. Until we can bring that into some form of institution that is ours..I see it as survival yes.

I guess it goes back to the equation that without identifiable and strong cultural buffersthen those saftey nets wont be built as a matter of course. Like the wheel follows the cart. Also I dont buy this war torn country argument. While plenty from the continent are from these areas plenty are affluent by their own countries standards and come from euqally stable places like Nigeria/ Ghana/ Cameroon. Continental African youth as a rule 20-25 years ago were studious and strong in their culture. Same people from the same places are turning top shotta now. My point is even with 'strong' culture you still need to build safety net here to escape the madness. Or perhaps their culture is not as strong as it we would believe. Proof is in the pudding so to speak.

Id like to say the same. But all Im doing now is thinking ways of circumventing the bull.. Moving out of London is an option Ive been thinking with 'wifey'. But my argument is I would not want to bring up my child in an exclusive white environment. But am I looking to bring up my child in my present London environment. No way. Cant see how it can work. And not prepared to gamble either.

BT - admirable honest reply. It's almost like a death sentence trying to fool oneself that our existence is anything other than survival, for all my intricacies I'm quite a simple person, I look at things and say what's so hard for example boy meets girl and live happily ever after I mean what's so difficult?

The scary thing for me is the reality that for all the people you believe you are 'helping' and uniting the likelihood is that it's them who probably saw you coming a long time ago where you're simply a tool for their own survival, sellout or credit for knowing the real game?

Even worse we come to places like the Village fronting like we really give a damn....guess it explains the fascination with sh!t like Eastenders and Big Brother and why the efforts of people like Toyin of Ligali get passed of as the rantings of a mad professor by the safety in numbers mass - but hey, if any of this is true then even the majority of people following and sniffing Ligali's batty probably saw Toyin coming too....indeed some would argue it's Toyin who saw them in an attempt to attribute that same survival mindset to him.

United in being disunited, it doesn't get more wotlisss than that.