Hillary Clinton's concession speech will happen 5pm UK time..CNN,Fox etc.... - Page 2

bibadiva73 · (#26 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by jett Black

Well Jimmy Carter says that it would be a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuge mistake for Obama to choose Billary as his running mate...a disaster even.

Interestingly Jimmy Carter is the only living ex-president who basically gets treated like shit by his own party and by a number of Americans.Usually ex-prez's get treated like royalty,however he has been shunned for his views and actions in the 70's.Watch this space to see if he'll even be invited to any of the major Democratic events over the next few months..........

But mostly I believe the disdain for him is because he wont bend down and take it in the ass from the Jews!

I think that Carter is being dismissed as irrelevant--even senile by some of his political colleagues. Carter was one of the best presidents we have ever had, because of his sensitivity to international issues unlike Bush the idiot who has managed to turn most of the world against America. McCain is like another Bush to me and I think that the Democratic party needs to do something to keep McCain out of getting elected-- i.e. address the recession we are in-- ridiculous gas prices, people losing their homes to foreclosure and the nearly 44 million Americans who don't have health care and our horribly backward education system. Those are the real issues that the Democratic party needs to focus on and to actually come up with a plan for these problems.All the Republicans care about is discrediting Obama by questioning his patriotism or accusing him of being a Muslim which they now equate with being a terrorist which is ridiculous, demonizing his wife MIchelle, and staying in Iraq while convincing people it's still a good idea--which it isn't. People care about real issues that affect their lives, not this garbage.

Gmahogany777 · (#27 (**permalink**))

@JB, Carter is being dismissed and ignored for several reasons. One, he was a TERRIBLE president, both on the domestic front and internationally. Inflation was skyhigh under his reign, there were gas shortages, a general sense of malaise hung over the country, AND the Iranian hostage crisis happened on his watch.

His peace at any cost leanings bit him in the ass because he was seen as weak and because of that, foreign dictators like the Ayahtollah TESTED him in ways that they would never have tested someone who was known for busting people's asses, a la Ronald Ray-gun. It's no coincidence that after holding those hostages for over a year, the Iranians decided to release them on the DAY Ronald Reagan was inaugurated. They could have released those hostages at any time and saved Carter's presidency but they didn't why? because they had NO respect for him, in spite of his tendencies toward wanting to play footsies with their ilk.

The other reason folks take what Carter says about the Clintons with a grain of salt is becaue it is well known that he does not like Bill Clinton. It's some kind of "i'm a former southern governor and President and so are You", type of competition dislike thing.

Choice of VP is a pragmatic decision not an emotional one, (like politics in general, which is something Black folks have yet to grasp). If when August comes private polling tells Obama he needs Hillary to win, he will offer her VP, if it doesn't, he won't, simple as. The Kennedy's hated LBJ, but when Aug rolled around and they found he could deliver the South, according to polls, guess what??????

Beyond that, I don't think there is any real personal animus between Obama and Clinton. I think their supporters take it personally, but they don't cause they are politicians and they understand the runnings and know how to not catch feelings about what happens in the heat of battle. I HAVE heard that Bill Clinton is still upset because he feels that Obama's campaign unfairly tried to paint comments he made as racist when they weren't, and the campaign KNEW they weren't.

jett Black · (#28 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gmahogany777

@JB, Carter is being dismissed and ignored for several reasons. One, he was a TERRIBLE president, both on the domestic front and internationally. Inflation was skyhigh under his reign, there were gas shortages, a general sense of malaise hung over the country, AND the Iranian hostage crisis happened on his watch.

His peace at any cost leanings bit him in the ass because he was seen as weak and because of that, foreign dictators like the Ayahtollah TESTED him in ways that they would never have tested someone who was known for busting people's asses, a la Ronald Ray-gun. It's no coincidence that after holding those hostages for over a year, the Iranians decided to release them on the DAY Ronald Reagan was inaugurated. They could have released those hostages at any time and saved Carter's presidency but they didn't why? because they had NO respect for him, in spite of his tendencies toward wanting to play footsies with their ilk.

The other reason folks take what Carter says about the Clintons with a grain of salt is becaue it is well known that he does not like Bill Clinton. It's some kind of "i'm a former southern governor and President and so are You", type of competition dislike thing.

Choice of VP is a pragmatic decision not an emotional one, (like politics in general, which is something Black folks have yet to grasp). If when August comes private polling tells Obama he needs Hillary to win, he will offer her VP, if it doesn't, he won't, simple as. The Kennedy's hated LBJ, but when Aug rolled around and they found he could deliver the South, according to polls, guess what??????

Beyond that, I don't think there is any real personal animus between Obama and Clinton. I think their supporters take it personally, but they don't cause they are politicians and they understand the runnings and know how to not catch feelings about what happens in the heat of battle. I HAVE heard that Bill Clinton is still upset because he feels that Obama's campaign unfairly tried to paint comments he made as racist when they weren't, and the campaign KNEW they weren't.

I wasn't aware of the hostilities between he and the Clinton's.

Was Carter really that bad though??

Carter was the President of my single digit childhood years so I only have recollections of him and peanuts,lol,I have a vague remembering of gas shortages etc but it didn't "feel" like America was on the brink of disaster.I concede that he may have been seen as weak but I still think it's off-key the way he is treated by his own party.

Gmahogany777 · (#29 (**permalink**))

@JB,
I was also in the general age range u mentioned when Carter was Prez, though I think I have you by a few years. I don’t really remember the details of his presidency clearly, but what I do remember clearly is when he ran for reelection in 1980. My school had a mock election and since I lived in the DC area politics was always all around and closely followed by folks, even bums on the corner can cogently discuss politics with u in DC. What I don’t remember in details, I’ve gleaned from older folks who do remember his presidency. To a person, I’ve never met anyone who characterizes his presidency as successful. Even those who liked him, think he’s a decent dude, and applaud what he’s done SINCE he left office. No one thinks he was a good president.

Don’t get me wrong, Reagan’s tenure was terrible as far as economics TOO, inflation came down a little, but was still high. The difference is under Carter, things were jacked up on the domestic/economic front AND on the foreign policy front. Americans will forgive you for having them broke or they will forgive you for allowing them to get punked and chumped by other countries, but they won’t forgive you for BOTH at the same time,lol. That was Carter’s dilemma. Beyond that, as u said he was just perceived as weak and defeated as a general personality type, while Reagan had a swagger and an optimism in his personality. I share a B-day with Reagan,btw Feb 6, so I totally understand his personality type,lol.

Another way I know that Carter was not viewed favorably was the way he was treated during the Dem convention when trying to get re-elected. You mentioned the messed up way he’s treated by his own party. That is the general operating procedure of the Dem party, it’s not unique to him. They’ve treated Bill Clinton like shit during this campaign and he is the ONLY 2 term president they’ve managed to have in the past 40 years, and was regarded as having had successful and prosperous presidency (peace and prosperity) by most folks,(his personal flaws notwithstanding). They treat their “winners” like crap when something new comes along, so you know those who have been viewed as failures ain’t got nothing coming,lol. That’s one way that the Republicans are much better than they are, they don’t dog their own folks out, even their losers…….

Back to the convention of 1980, it was clear that he was perceived as weak and someone the party was “stuck with” and not likely to win from the treatment he received from his own party. I clearly remember that he and Ted Kennedy had a bitter primary fight and when Carter won the nomination Kennedy totally DISSED him. At the convention when Carter tried to grab Kennedy’s hand to show that the party was united, Kennedy refused and kept moving to another part of the stage. It’s funny to me cause Kennedy was nowhere near Carter in popular vote or delegates but he still carried on that way. Yet you have folks acting like HRC committed bloody murder cause she didn’t concede on the last night of the primary. That’s how I can always tell whether people just started paying attention to politics or whether they been doing it for a while, HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE. BTW, there are people who NEVER concede in these things, quiet as it’s kept). Not at the end of the primaries not before the convention, not during the convention, not after the convention,lol.

It was also funny to me to hear people like Ted Kennedy take on this high minded, finger wagging tone with the Clintons about grace and class. I remember what he did in 1980 and I remember how dejected and disrespected Carter looked. Kennedy’s antics and that acrimony caused Carter to lose to Reagan in 80. Now granted, he probably would have lost anyway, but it might not have been a landslide like it ended up being.

jett Black · (#30 (**permalink**))

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gmahogany777

@JB,
I was also in the general age range u mentioned when Carter was Prez, though I think I have you by a few years. I don’t really remember the details of his presidency clearly, but what I do remember clearly is when he ran for reelection in 1980. My school had a mock election and since I lived in the DC area politics was always all around and closely followed by folks, even bums on the corner can cogently discuss politics with u in DC. What I don’t remember in details, I’ve gleaned from older folks who do remember his presidency. To a person, I’ve never met anyone who characterizes his presidency as successful. Even those who liked him, think he’s a decent dude, and applaud what he’s done SINCE he left office. No one thinks he was a good president.

Don’t get me wrong, Reagan’s tenure was terrible as far as economics TOO, inflation came down a little, but was still high. The difference is under Carter, things were jacked up on the domestic/economic front AND on the foreign policy front. Americans will forgive you for having them broke or they will forgive you for allowing them to get punked and chumped by other countries, but they won’t forgive you for BOTH at the same time,lol. That was Carter’s dilemma. Beyond that, as u said he was just perceived as weak and defeated as a general personality type, while Reagan had a swagger and an optimism in his personality. I share a B-day with Reagan,btw Feb 6, so I totally understand his personality type,lol.

Another way I know that Carter was not viewed favorably was the way he was treated during the Dem convention when trying to get re-elected. You mentioned the messed up way he’s treated by his own party. That is the general operating procedure of the Dem party, it’s not unique to him. They’ve treated Bill Clinton like shit during this campaign and he is the ONLY 2 term president they’ve managed to have in the past 40 years, and was regarded as having had successful and prosperous presidency (peace and prosperity) by most folks,(his personal flaws notwithstanding). They treat their “winners” like crap when something new comes along, so you know those who have been viewed as failures ain’t got nothing coming,lol. That’s one way that the Republicans are much better than they are, they don’t dog their own folks out, even their losers…….

Back to the convention of 1980, it was clear that he was perceived as weak and someone the party was “stuck with” and not likely to win from the treatment he received from his own party. I clearly remember that he and Ted Kennedy had a bitter primary fight and when Carter won the nomination Kennedy totally DISSED him. At the convention when Carter tried to grab Kennedy’s hand to show that the party was united, Kennedy refused and kept moving to another part of the stage. It’s funny to me cause Kennedy was nowhere near Carter in popular vote or delegates but he still carried on that way. Yet you have folks acting like HRC committed bloody murder cause she didn’t concede on the last night of the primary. That’s how I can always tell whether people just started paying attention to politics or whether they been doing it for a while, HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE. BTW, there are people who NEVER concede in these things, quiet as it’s kept). Not at the end of the primaries not before the convention, not during the convention, not after the convention,lol.

It was also funny to me to hear people like Ted Kennedy take on this high minded, finger wagging tone with the Clintons about grace and class. I remember what he did in 1980 and I remember how dejected and disrespected Carter looked. Kennedy’s antics and that acrimony caused Carter to lose to Reagan in 80. Now granted, he probably would have lost anyway, but it might not have been a landslide like it ended up being.

Yes, well I guess this would go some way to explain some why he seems to be trying to re-write or repair his legacy.The man is 81 or something and he should just be chilling but he has his fingers in many pies,I do feel slightly sorry for him actually,even though he was mostly ineffectual ,I believe he had his heart in the right place, but like you said America is not gonna be coolio with being broke as phuck AND being fisted by other countries.

As for Ted Kennedy"grace and class"...ha! Chappaquidick(SP)anyone???...that whole family is well.........and I understand Caroline is on the committee to help Obama choose his VP.

Hmmmmmmmmm??